I've been doing some thinking on the differences in values between the older generations and the younger ones for a while now, and here's the general difference I see.

The older generations, including the Greatest Generation, that suffered hardships (many were the children of immigrants, and there was also the Great Depression); that were raised with real discipline; that were taught values, not strictly religious values per se, but general values such as respect, honor, honesty, and work ethic; were the genarations that won two world wars and turned what was almost a third world country into the world's economic and manufacturing powerhouse.

The younger generations (of which I am a part) have not gone through any real hardships, though that could change if we get 4 more years of Obamanomics. For the most parts, the kids of today are being raised by the children of the hippie generation. Because of this, most are raised with a lack of values, or in some extreme cases, a rejection of values as "relics of convention". The younger generations feel entitled to everything, and they want it as soon as possible. When these kids start taking over, we will likely see changes on the magnitude of the Greatest Generation and their predecessors, but in the opposite direction. We got a small taste of that 4 years ago.

I wouldn't start to give up hope yet. There are still many, many great kids out there, striving hard to excell in academics and athletics, serving in our military, upholding a great many traditional values and too smart to be taken in by the whining, selfish rhetoric of the malcontents.

Trust me, they are out there, but you don't see them because they aren't the one's complaining and protesting and occupying and getting their mugs on the 6 o clock news every night.

I agree with Door Kicker. While certainly we've lost a bit of our sense of independence and work ethic with each passing generation, there are still many young people who understand the value of hard work and discipline. I see it with the kids I see at church every Sunday. Most of them aren't shy about helping out with chores. It all comes down to, as CubaLibre points out, parenting.

Quote from: CubaLibre on June 21, 2012, 02:22:02 PM
I've been doing some thinking on the differences in values between the older generations and the younger ones for a while now, and here's the general difference I see.

The older generations, including the Greatest Generation, that suffered hardships (many were the children of immigrants, and there was also the Great Depression); that were raised with real discipline; that were taught values, not strictly religious values per se, but general values such as respect, honor, honesty, and work ethic; were the genarations that won two world wars and turned what was almost a third world country into the world's economic and manufacturing powerhouse.

The younger generations (of which I am a part) have not gone through any real hardships, though that could change if we get 4 more years of Obamanomics. For the most parts, the kids of today are being raised by the children of the hippie generation. Because of this, most are raised with a lack of values, or in some extreme cases, a rejection of values as "relics of convention". The younger generations feel entitled to everything, and they want it as soon as possible. When these kids start taking over, we will likely see changes on the magnitude of the Greatest Generation and their predecessors, but in the opposite direction. We got a small taste of that 4 years ago.

Allow me to use the words of a great author to describe the down fall of America:

"The America of today is a laboratory example if what can happen to democracies, what has eventually happened to all perfect democracies throughout history.  A perfect democracy, a 'warm body' democracy in which every adult may vote and all votes count equally, has no internal feedback for self-correction.  It depends solely on the wisdom and self-restraint of citizens... which is opposed by the folly and lack of  self-restraint of other citizens.  What is supposed to happen in a democracy is that each sovereign citizen will always vote in public interest for the safety and welfare of all.  But what does happen is that he votes his own self-interest as he sees it... which for the majority translates as 'Bread and Circuses'.

Bread and Circuses is the cancer of democracy, the fatal disease for which there is no cure.  Democracy often works beautifully at first.  But once the state extends the franchise to every warm body, be he producer or parasite, that day marks the beginning of the end of the state.  For when the plebs discover that they can vote themselves bread and circuses without limit and that the productive members of the body politic cannot stop them, they will do so, until the state bleeds to death, or in it's weakened condition the state succums to an invader - the barbarians enter Rome."

Did you here about the lady on the bus that was being taunted by the kids?

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/story/2012-06-21/bus-taunt-victim-fundraising/55729944/1

The kids like this, were raised by parents like this. They are still in the minority.

Conservatives have been so busy working and raising kids, (properly), that we've allowed the liberals to hijack all public discourse. The media, our schools, and our government. They are still in the minority........................and they are a cancer on our society.

The fact that they aren't allowed to hear about it, has caused many of our young people to look into conservatism on their own..............they are not only understanding it, but that they are recognizing the societal rot that liberal, socialist policies have to offer.

Don't give up on our young people. Many of them simply have not been taught the right way to live. It's time for a resurgence of pride, self respect, respect for others, and an understanding of the founding principles of this country.

It's up to us to help shepard it in. No longer, can we afford to be the silent majority.

Met a kid at the beach last weekend.....................he was about to be shipped off to Afghanistan. Born in 1991. I'm not throwing in the towel on the kids. It's just that the stupid ones make the most noise...................just like their parents.

Don't get me wrong, guys. I'm not giving up hope just yet, but it seems like the big picture problem is a cultural/individual problem, more so than a political one, and not many people seem willing to make the necessary changes. 

Quote from: CubaLibre on June 21, 2012, 05:20:03 PM
Don't get me wrong, guys. I'm not giving up hope just yet, but it seems like the big picture problem is a cultural/individual problem, more so than a political one, and not many people seem willing to make the necessary changes. 

Interesting point of view.

But perhaps it is the role of politics in influencing the culture and attitudes of individuals that is at fault.

Specifically, I would point to the effects of inflation on an individual's appreciation for the need to prepare for the future.

Inflation destroys the incentive to save as money today is worth more than money tomorrow and cheap credit like wise encourages borrowing and debt accumulation.

The generational effect of inflation is to instill in individuals a higher concern for the now that unduly neglects the future- to our individual and collective destruction.

Social welfare policies have the same effect. For example older people unduly discount the need to prepare for the future due to social security and medicare.

So this is all to say that politics itself has an influence on our individual attitudes and preferences- and not for the better.

Quote from: TowardLiberty on June 21, 2012, 05:29:43 PM
Interesting point of view.

But perhaps it is the role of politics in influencing the culture and attitudes of individuals that is at fault.

Specifically, I would point to the effects of inflation on an individual's appreciation for the need to prepare for the future.

Inflation destroys the incentive to save as money today is worth more than money tomorrow and cheap credit like wise encourages borrowing and debt accumulation.

The generational effect of inflation is to instill in individuals a higher concern for the now that unduly neglects the future- to our individual and collective destruction.

Social welfare policies have the same effect. For example older people unduly discount the need to prepare for the future due to social security and medicare.

So this is all to say that politics itself has an influence on our individual attitudes and preferences- and not for the better.

Sounds like a call for more personal responsibility and a much smaller role for government, to me.

Lets get'r done. I think we're on the cusp of losing the opportunity. Time to put love of God, Family, and Country at the forefront. I'd like to think that the liberal nonsense has finally awakened a sleeping monster. It's up to us to set them straight.

I'm actively working at, not just being pissed off, but being able to explain conservatism in a rational way. It takes time. Our young people are being brain washed.

I hate to admit it, but so are we. Christians are called stupid. Hunters are called murderers......................we're slowly falling for it.

Well, as long as I'm alive, I'm not going to allow conservatism and decency be shoved into the closet. The time to stand, is now.

I'm not going to stand back any longer and be called a racist, homophobe, hater. I'm not any of those things..............and I'm sick of it.

Quote from: kramarat on June 21, 2012, 09:28:27 PM
Sounds like a call for more personal responsibility and a much smaller role for government, to me.

Definitely.

A return to a sound money would force the government to shrink..

Quote

Lets get'r done. I think we're on the cusp of losing the opportunity. Time to put love of God, Family, and Country at the forefront. I'd like to think that the liberal nonsense has finally awakened a sleeping monster. It's up to us to set them straight.

I'm actively working at, not just being pissed off, but being able to explain conservatism in a rational way. It takes time. Our young people are being brain washed.

I hate to admit it, but so are we. Christians are called stupid. Hunters are called murderers......................we're slowly falling for it.

Well, as long as I'm alive, I'm not going to allow conservatism and decency be shoved into the closet. The time to stand, is now.

I'm not going to stand back any longer and be called a racist, homophobe, hater. I'm not any of those things..............and I'm sick of it.

Those are noble goals. Being able to express the benefits of liberty and markets in a rational way is also a goal of mine.

And I think the opportunity for change is riper than it has been in the past. It usually takes some adversity to wake people up.

And the internet is the tool to spread the ideas of freedom to a new audience- just like the printing press was.

Quote from: TowardLiberty on June 21, 2012, 10:23:27 PM
Definitely.

A return to a sound money would force the government to shrink..

Those are noble goals. Being able to express the benefits of liberty and markets in a rational way is also a goal of mine.

And I think the opportunity for change is riper than it has been in the past. It usually takes some adversity to wake people up.

And the internet is the tool to spread the ideas of freedom to a new audience- just like the printing press was.

Absolutely.

I've got a liberal friend visiting from out of town, a neighbor with a liberal leaning college kid, that likes to come down and talk to me, etc.

It takes time and patience to get them to pull their fingers out of their ears and listen, but it's possible. It's funny..................the primary commonality that I find with liberals, is not an ideology, but an intense hatred for Rush Limbaugh.

My noble goals aren't that noble. They stem from genuine fear. Even if we beat Obama, it's just one small battle. Like zombies in a horror movie, liberals will not stop until they have turned this country into something they don't even understand. They think they want socialism, but have never visited any countries where it is in place. Countries where the populations are equal and miserable.

Obama has been a wake up call to how quickly things can change. He's spent 3 years bastardizing the US Constitution, and for the most part, no one has seriously challenged him. It's terrifying.

Quote from: rich_t on June 21, 2012, 04:42:43 PM
Allow me to use the words of a great author to describe the down fall of America:

"The America of today is a laboratory example if what can happen to democracies, what has eventually happened to all perfect democracies throughout history.  A perfect democracy, a 'warm body' democracy in which every adult may vote and all votes count equally, has no internal feedback for self-correction.  It depends solely on the wisdom and self-restraint of citizens... which is opposed by the folly and lack of  self-restraint of other citizens.  What is supposed to happen in a democracy is that each sovereign citizen will always vote in public interest for the safety and welfare of all.  But what does happen is that he votes his own self-interest as he sees it... which for the majority translates as 'Bread and Circuses'.

Bread and Circuses is the cancer of democracy, the fatal disease for which there is no cure.  Democracy often works beautifully at first.  But once the state extends the franchise to every warm body, be he producer or parasite, that day marks the beginning of the end of the state.  For when the plebs discover that they can vote themselves bread and circuses without limit and that the productive members of the body politic cannot stop them, they will do so, until the state bleeds to death, or in it's weakened condition the state succums to an invader - the barbarians enter Rome."

In his book Starship Troopers, Robert Heinlein described a society where only honorably discharged military veterans were allowed to vote; the logic behind his premise being that they volunteered for hazardous duty at low pay and hence were not driven by greed or fear, put self-interests aside for the benefit of their unit and were more likely to vote intelligently for the common good of the country they were willing to die for.

Naturally he came under heavy criticism. 

Quote from: kramarat on June 22, 2012, 04:32:10 AM
Obama has been a wake up call to how quickly things can change. He's spent 3 years bastardizing the US Constitution, and for the most part, no one has seriously challenged him. It's terrifying.

The scary thing is how little he actually accomplished in his first two years given a complicit Congress.  As it turns out, the nation should be grateful for Obama's lack of experience.  Had he been more competent, we'd have seen a lot more transformational laws signed than just Obamacare.

Quote from: Door Kicker on June 22, 2012, 04:52:20 AM


In his book Starship Troopers, Robert Heinlein described a society where only honorably discharged military veterans were allowed to vote; the logic behind his premise being that they volunteered for hazardous duty at low pay and hence were not driven by greed or fear, put self-interests aside for the benefit of their unit and were more likely to vote intelligently for the common good of the country they were willing to die for.

Naturally he came under heavy criticism.

He also made the point that these veterans have proven that they are willing to fight and die for their beliefs, which gives them a decided advantage over "armchair" revolutionaries who prefer to send "jack booted thugs" to enforce their will. 

Quote from: Eccles102 on June 22, 2012, 06:12:55 AM
The scary thing is how little he actually accomplished in his first two years given a complicit Congress.  As it turns out, the nation should be grateful for Obama's lack of experience.  Had he been more competent, we'd have seen a lot more transformational laws signed than just Obamacare.

You've got to give him credit though. He's using the EPA, and every other agency that he can, to push through new rules and regulations..........................bypassing congress completly. Remember the little girl in NC that got her home made lunch snatched away from her.......................Dept of Agriculture.

Quote from: CubaLibre on June 21, 2012, 02:22:02 PM
I've been doing some thinking on the differences in values between the older generations and the younger ones for a while now, and here's the general difference I see.

The older generations, including the Greatest Generation, that suffered hardships (many were the children of immigrants, and there was also the Great Depression); that were raised with real discipline; that were taught values, not strictly religious values per se, but general values such as respect, honor, honesty, and work ethic; were the genarations that won two world wars and turned what was almost a third world country into the world's economic and manufacturing powerhouse.

The younger generations (of which I am a part) have not gone through any real hardships, though that could change if we get 4 more years of Obamanomics. For the most parts, the kids of today are being raised by the children of the hippie generation. Because of this, most are raised with a lack of values, or in some extreme cases, a rejection of values as "relics of convention". The younger generations feel entitled to everything, and they want it as soon as possible. When these kids start taking over, we will likely see changes on the magnitude of the Greatest Generation and their predecessors, but in the opposite direction. We got a small taste of that 4 years ago.

Well, we don't have to go back to the Greatest Generation for inspiring stories.  One of my current inspirations is Florida Congresswoman Sandy Adams.  Enlisted in the USAF at 17.  Bailed out of an abusive marriage and became a single parent with no HS diploma...Did she become a permanent welfare case?  No...earned a GED, became a county deputy sheriff, married another cop who died in the line of duty, put herself through college, ousted the sitting Democrat for her House seat in the 2010 Republican landslide.  Watch her grill Eric Holder during the Fast and Furious hearings (good stuff):

Adams Grills Holder Over Fast and Furious Operation

One tough lady.  Her official bio:

http://adams.house.gov/Biography/