I enjoyed my morning coffee, listening to Fox coverage of the current hostage crisis. A Muslim woman was speaking out about the hijacking of the Muslim religion by ISLAMISTS, and she differenciated between the vast majority of Muslims and the radical ISLAMISTs who are perverting their faith!  She said that most of those who are being killed and persecuted by the ISLAMISTS, are in fact other Muslims. She said there is real danger in (our) not exposing the ideology of the ISLAMISTS; that they are devout followers of a distorted sect of the Islamic Faith, who use violence and inti,midation to spread their "Faith".  She said that as a Muslim herself, it was necessary for her to speak out.  She also congratulated the people at FOX for daring to speak out and said even by doing so they are making themselves targets! (I think I perceived a collective nervous gulp)

I often want to see how the (any) news is being portrayed to Americans who don't (won't) watch FOX, so I turned over to the OBAMACHANNEL and began watching "Mornning Joe".  I was quite suprized!  Although, they didn't refer to the terrorists as ISLAMISTS and at least one of their Liberal Talking Heads began to give excuses for "the brothers" by giving the sob story of what amounted to their psyco/social history, another Muslim women spoke out about the hijacking of their religion and the danger of our not speaking out in opposition of this movement of the radical branch of Islam.  She said that even today, in Saudi Arabia, their is a PUBLIC FLOGGING scheduled.  The man, is a blogger who was found guilty of having said something that was deemed to have insulted The Phophet Mohammed! He was sentenced to be publicly flogged 100 times  (that ought to kill the poor SOB)

It  occurred to me, that the other day on one of the Business shows, they were saying that the Saudi's were flooding the market with cheap oil in an attempt to destroy the development of our oil industry, making it too expensive and less profitable.  The discussion centered around the real threat the Saudi's feel of our "energy independence" being in sight and they want to put an end to this.

Considering that the Saudi's are Wahabi Sunnies, as was Osama Bin Laden and Wahabi's practice a strict interpretation of the Quran and the Saudi's fund Madrasses (religious schools) all over the world, including here in the US is there ideology the proximate cause of the Terrorism?   I wonder?

I also wonder why our Ass-Clown in Chief bowed to this Third World Despot?

Quote from: wally on January 09, 2015, 04:51:56 AM
I enjoyed my morning coffee, listening to Fox coverage of the current hostage crisis. A Muslim woman was speaking out about the hijacking of the Muslim religion by ISLAMISTS, and she differenciated between the vast majority of Muslims and the radical ISLAMISTs who are perverting their faith!  She said that most of those who are being killed and persecuted by the ISLAMISTS, are in fact other Muslims. She said there is real danger in (our) not exposing the ideology of the ISLAMISTS; that they are devout followers of a distorted sect of the Islamic Faith, who use violence and inti,midation to spread their "Faith".  She said that as a Muslim herself, it was necessary for her to speak out.  She also congratulated the people at FOX for daring to speak out and said even by doing so they are making themselves targets! (I think I perceived a collective nervous gulp)

I often want to see how the (any) news is being portrayed to Americans who don't (won't) watch FOX, so I turned over to the OBAMACHANNEL and began watching "Mornning Joe".  I was quite suprized!  Although, they didn't refer to the terrorists as ISLAMISTS and at least one of their Liberal Talking Heads began to give excuses for "the brothers" by giving the sob story of what amounted to their psyco/social history, another Muslim women spoke out about the hijacking of their religion and the danger of our not speaking out in opposition of this movement of the radical branch of Islam.  She said that even today, in Saudi Arabia, their is a PUBLIC FLOGGING scheduled.  The man, is a blogger who was found guilty of having said something that was deemed to have insulted The Phophet Mohammed!

It  occurred to me, that the other day on one of the Business shows, they were saying that the Saudi's were flooding the market with cheap oil in an attempt to destroy the development of our oil industry, making it too expensive and less profitable.  The discussion centered around the real threat the Saudi's feel of our "energy independence" being in sight and they want to put an end to this.

Considering that the Saudi's are Wahabi Sunnies, as was Osama Bin Laden and Wahabi's practice a strict interpretation of the Quran and the Saudi's fund Madrasses (religious schools) all over the world, including here in the US is there ideology the proximate cause of the Terrorism?   I wonder?

I also wonder why our Ass-Clown in Chief bowed to this Third World Despot?

Because the Shia muslims are so much better  It may be the sunni's that are behind most if not all terrorist attacks agains the West, and we may see ourselves allied with Iran, but I would not be so gullible as to believe that the answer lies with supporting Shia Muslims as the Theocracy of Iran is only non threatening because they are so incompetent. If they had the capability as they had in the Iraq insurrection with supporting shia militias to kill Americans, they would still be supporting terrorism.

The problem is Islam, and until all muslims renounce their faith or are expelled and quarantined in the shithole they call nations there will never be Peace.

Quote from: Mountainshield on January 09, 2015, 05:04:16 AM
Because the Shia muslims are so much better  It may be the sunni's that are behind most if not all terrorist attacks agains the West, and we may see ourselves allied with Iran, but I would not be so gullible as to believe that the answer lies with supporting Shia Muslims as the Theocracy of Iran is only non threatening because they are so incompetent. If they had the capability as they had in the Iraq insurrection with supporting shia militias to kill Americans, they would still be supporting terrorism.

The problem is Islam, and until all muslims renounce their faith or are expelled and quarantined in the shithole they call nations there will never be Peace.

I doubt that 1.6 Billion people (most not even in the Middle East) are going to ever "renounce their faith" and have a Come to Jesus Moment!

ISIS (ISIL) has a lot of SADDAM HUSSAIN's former military (members and Leaders).  Iraq is a Sunni Muslim country, as is Saudi Arabia and AL Quada!

Nonetheless, IRAN, who is a state sponsor of International Terrorism, is a Shia Muslim nation!
Their Ayotollas and Imans follow a perverted interpretation of Islam, as well.

The Muslim people are held hostage by their Leaders and they bow to the power they wield!

The problem is not RELIGION; It's the POWER IN THE HANDS OF A FEW PERVERSE RELIGIOUS FANATICS, who rule over their people with ruthless, barbaric violence!

Because he's an idiot who doesn't know that the President represents the sovereignty of the American people and thus is NOT supposed to bow to these moron's errr I mean Monarchs.

Quote from: daidalos on January 09, 2015, 05:24:08 AM
Because he's an idiot who doesn't know that the President represents the sovereignty of the American people and thus is NOT supposed to bow to these moron's errr I mean Monarchs.

I agree...   Perhaps equally important is the image to the world of the shining city on the hill, has just become another third world ghetto!

Quote from: wally on January 09, 2015, 05:18:01 AM
I doubt that 1.6 Billion people (most not even in the Middle East) are going to ever "renounce their faith" and have a Come to Jesus Moment!

ISIS (ISIL) has a lot of SADDAM HUSSAIN's former military (members and Leaders).  Iraq is a Sunni Muslim country, as is Saudi Arabia and AL Quada!

Nonetheless, IRAN, who is a state sponsor of International Terrorism, is a Shia Muslim nation!
Their Ayotollas and Imans follow a perverted interpretation of Islam, as well.

The Muslim people are held hostage by their Leaders and they bow to the power they wield!

The problem is not RELIGION; It's the POWER IN THE HANDS OF A FEW PERVERSE RELIGIOUS FANATICS, who rule over their people with ruthless, barbaric violence!

The problem is RELIGION

Quran (4:74) - "Let those fight in the way of Allah who sell the life of this world for the other. Whoso fighteth in the way of Allah, be he slain or be he victorious, on him We shall bestow a vast reward." 

Quran (2:191-193) - "And kill them wherever you find them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out. And Al-Fitnah [disbelief] is worse than killing...

but if they desist, then lo! Allah is forgiving and merciful.   And fight them until there is no more Fitnah

Quran (3:151) - "Soon shall We cast terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers, for that they joined companions with Allah, for which He had sent no authority".

Quran (4:95) - "Not equal are those believers who sit (at home) and receive no hurt, and those who strive and fight in the cause of Allah with their goods and their persons. Allah hath granted a grade higher to those who strive and fight with their goods and persons than to those who sit (at home). Unto all (in Faith) Hath Allah promised good: But those who strive and fight Hath He distinguished above those who sit (at home) by a special reward,-"

Quran (4:104) - "And be not weak hearted in pursuit of the enemy; if you suffer pain, then surely they (too) suffer pain as you suffer pain..."

Quran (5:33) - "The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His messenger and strive to make mischief in the land is only this, that they should be murdered or crucified or their hands and their feet should be cut off on opposite sides or they should be imprisoned; this shall be as a disgrace for them in this world, and in the hereafter they shall have a grievous chastisement"

Quran (8:12) - "I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them"

Quran (8:15) - "O ye who believe! When ye meet those who disbelieve in battle, turn not your backs to them. (16)Whoso on that day turneth his back to them, unless maneuvering for battle or intent to join a company, he truly hath incurred wrath from Allah, and his habitation will be hell, a hapless journey's end."

Quran (8:39) - "And fight with them until there is no more fitna (disorder, unbelief) and religion should be only for Allah" 

Either they die, or we die. As long as you continue to buy the liberal narrative that most Muslims do not support the Koran as it is written black on white and refuse to acknowledge that Islam is the disease then there will always be war until they outbreed us and wipe us out in our own countries. Remember that lying to infidels is accepted in the Koran, the muslim spokeperson speaking for all the "moderate" muslims out there is either clueless or lying.

Quote from: Mountainshield on January 09, 2015, 05:51:39 AM
The problem is RELIGION

Quran (4:74) - "Let those fight in the way of Allah who sell the life of this world for the other. Whoso fighteth in the way of Allah, be he slain or be he victorious, on him We shall bestow a vast reward." 

Quran (2:191-193) - "And kill them wherever you find them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out. And Al-Fitnah [disbelief] is worse than killing...

but if they desist, then lo! Allah is forgiving and merciful.   And fight them until there is no more Fitnah

Quran (3:151) - "Soon shall We cast terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers, for that they joined companions with Allah, for which He had sent no authority".

Quran (4:95) - "Not equal are those believers who sit (at home) and receive no hurt, and those who strive and fight in the cause of Allah with their goods and their persons. Allah hath granted a grade higher to those who strive and fight with their goods and persons than to those who sit (at home). Unto all (in Faith) Hath Allah promised good: But those who strive and fight Hath He distinguished above those who sit (at home) by a special reward,-"

Quran (4:104) - "And be not weak hearted in pursuit of the enemy; if you suffer pain, then surely they (too) suffer pain as you suffer pain..."

Quran (5:33) - "The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His messenger and strive to make mischief in the land is only this, that they should be murdered or crucified or their hands and their feet should be cut off on opposite sides or they should be imprisoned; this shall be as a disgrace for them in this world, and in the hereafter they shall have a grievous chastisement"

Quran (8:12) - "I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them"

Quran (8:15) - "O ye who believe! When ye meet those who disbelieve in battle, turn not your backs to them. (16)Whoso on that day turneth his back to them, unless maneuvering for battle or intent to join a company, he truly hath incurred wrath from Allah, and his habitation will be hell, a hapless journey's end."

Quran (8:39) - "And fight with them until there is no more fitna (disorder, unbelief) and religion should be only for Allah" 

Either they die, or we die. As long as you continue to buy the liberal narrative that most Muslims do not support the Koran as it is written black on white and refuse to acknowledge that Islam is the disease then there will always be war until they outbreed us and wipe us out in our own countries. Remember that lying to infidels is accepted in the Koran, the muslim spokeperson speaking for all the "moderate" muslims out there is either clueless or lying.

One could lift selected quotes out of the Bible that presents the justification for crusades and holy war to spead Christianity throughout the world.  It would be either ignorant of stupid to think that it's a liberal narrative that most Christians do not support the Bible (or that they support every word of both the old and new testiments as being an instruction from God for them to slay the nonBelievers and subjegate the world under their control!

I do believe that it's a fact that most "Catholics" are Liberal, as are most Muslims.  I'm married to a Catholic, who is also a Teacher and a member of a Teacher Union.  Inspite of the stgerotypes, I can assure you that she is no Liberal!

If people believe in freedom and liberty above all else, it kind of puts God and religious teachings into a much better perspective!  Our Founders believed that our rights came from God and hense were (are) unalienable and no goverment (or religious hierarcy) can take those away.  Many of us in America still do believe this!  The furtherence of these rights promotes Liberty; the protection of these rights ensure Justice and the free exercise of these rights ensures Freedom for all of us.  One of the most basic (sacred) rights is the freedom of religion!

Quote from: wally on January 09, 2015, 06:12:47 AM
One could lift selected quotes out of the Bible that presents the justification for crusades and holy war to spead Christianity throughout the world.  It would be either ignorant of stupid to think that it's a liberal narrative that most Christians do not support the Bible (or that they support every word of both the old and new testiments as being an instruction from God for them to slay the nonBelievers and subjegate the world under their control!

This is absolutely true. That is why I've always said that Christianity is just one charismatic leader away from becoming the next Islam.

I'd don't say that to demean Christian, but to warn them!

QuoteI do believe that it's a fact that most "Catholics" are Liberal, as are most Muslims.  I'm married to a Catholic, who is also a Teacher and a member of a Teacher Union.  In spite of the stereotypes, I can assure you that she is no Liberal!

Having been raised Catholic (attended 12 years of parochial school) I can verify what you say about Catholics. Much like Jews in this country most are decidedly Liberal.

I will disagree, however, with you about Muslims. Muslims are extremely conservative - even non-radicalized Muslims are still clinging to beliefs and traditions that went the way of the dinosaur some 900 years ago! If given their choice, they would much rather live in a 12th Century Monarch (The Caliphate!).

QuoteIf people believe in freedom and liberty above all else, it kind of puts God and religious teachings into a much better perspective!  Our Founders believed that our rights came from God and hence were (are) unalienable and no government (or religious hierarchy) can take those away.  Many of us in America still do believe this!  The furtherance of these rights promotes Liberty; the protection of these rights ensure Justice and the free exercise of these rights ensures Freedom for all of us.  One of the most basic (sacred) rights is the freedom of religion!

In short, since God gave us a Free Will, what man has a right to interfere with that?

Quote from: Darth Fife on January 09, 2015, 08:34:14 AM
This is absolutely true. That is why I've always said that Christianity is just one charismatic leader away from becoming the next Islam.

I'd don't say that to demean Christian, but to warn them!

Having been raised Catholic (attended 12 years of parochial school) I can verify what you say about Catholics. Much like Jews in this country most are decidedly Liberal.

I will disagree, however, with you about Muslims. Muslims are extremely conservative - even non-radicalized Muslims are still clinging to beliefs and traditions that went the way of the dinosaur some 900 years ago! If given their choice, they would much rather live in a 12th Century Monarch (The Caliphate!).

In short, since God gave us a Free Will, what man has a right to interfere with that?

I'm  not a very good, Bible thumping Christian, but I've gone to  church enough to know that the message of brotherly love and fellowship is rather benign.  As a matter of fact, the teachings of Christianity too often emphasises the blessings of being meek, turning the other cheek and being good faithful followers of the Lamb and basically...SHEEP!

I doubt that we are "only on charismatic Leader away form being the next islam".  Of course, I'm not Catholic and see the Pope as just another guy is a long robe and a funny hat; although his hearts in the right place, like so many Libs, he allows his heart to dictate over reason and common sence!

Quote from: daidalos on January 09, 2015, 05:24:08 AM
Because he's an idiot who doesn't know that the President represents the sovereignty of the American people and thus is NOT supposed to bow to these moron's errr I mean Monarchs.

Because he is one of them.

We have a clash of civilizations.  While some Muslims do want modernity, there is a ruthless faction that wants sharia laws and the severe form of an Islamic government. 

I don't think anyone knows how to effectively fix/deal with this problem, but IMO radical Islam is a huge worldwide threat to all countries.  I guess the potential has always been there, so I'm not sure why we are surprised or unprepared, as it's been with us since Mohammed's time. 

My first memories of Islamic terrorism (didn't know what it was then) were International attacks by the PLO. 
 

Some muslims don't have the stomach to do the killing, stoning, beheading, maiming, lying, cheating that the koran approves of.

But rest assured that they are ALL happy that somebody's doing it, for their way of life and prophet, and to become world-wide.

I doubt there's 10 of them out there who think their koran or general outlook should be changed to include only love and decency, as Jesus / New Testament changed to.

And that's their game, claim that only a few are terrorists, which is totally dishonest, and claim that "lots of them" are against the terrorists.  Except nobody ever sees them.  One or two have been in the news...........so that's supposedly their "billion" that are peaceful.

And the libs eat it up, and expect everybody else to.

Quote from: Dori on January 09, 2015, 10:03:46 AM
We have a clash of civilizations.  While some Muslims do want modernity, there is a ruthless faction that wants sharia laws and the severe form of an Islamic government. 

I don't think anyone knows how to effectively fix/deal with this problem, but IMO radical Islam is a huge worldwide threat to all countries.  I guess the potential has always been there, so I'm not sure why we are surprised or unprepared, as it's been with us since Mohammed's time. 

My first memories of Islamic terrorism (didn't know what it was then) were International attacks by the PLO. 

Here's a very good explanation of what's happening!

http://video.foxnews.com/v/3979727819001/dr-qanta-ahmed-we-are-under-siege-by-islamism/?#sp=show-clips

Quote from: wally on January 09, 2015, 06:12:47 AM
One could lift selected quotes out of the Bible that presents the justification for crusades and holy war to spead Christianity throughout the world.  It would be either ignorant of stupid to think that it's a liberal narrative that most Christians do not support the Bible (or that they support every word of both the old and new testiments as being an instruction from God for them to slay the nonBelievers and subjegate the world under their control!

I do believe that it's a fact that most "Catholics" are Liberal, as are most Muslims.  I'm married to a Catholic, who is also a Teacher and a member of a Teacher Union.  Inspite of the stgerotypes, I can assure you that she is no Liberal!

If people believe in freedom and liberty above all else, it kind of puts God and religious teachings into a much better perspective!  Our Founders believed that our rights came from God and hense were (are) unalienable and no goverment (or religious hierarcy) can take those away.  Many of us in America still do believe this!  The furtherence of these rights promotes Liberty; the protection of these rights ensure Justice and the free exercise of these rights ensures Freedom for all of us.  One of the most basic (sacred) rights is the freedom of religion!

What Richard Dawkins had to say after the France attacks -

"No, all religions are NOT equally violent. Some have never been violent, some gave it up centuries ago. One religion conspicuously didn't," tweeted Dawkins.

"Of COURSE most Muslims are peaceful. But if someone's killed for what they drew or said or wrote, you KNOW the religion of the killers."

linky linky - http://www.christianpost.com/news/atheist-richard-dawkins-on-paris-terrorist-attack-all-religions-are-not-equally-violent-132281/

Quote from: AndyJackson on January 09, 2015, 02:08:30 PM
What Richard Dawkins had to say after the France attacks -

"No, all religions are NOT equally violent. Some have never been violent, some gave it up centuries ago. One religion conspicuously didn't," tweeted Dawkins.

"Of COURSE most Muslims are peaceful. But if someone's killed for what they drew or said or wrote, you KNOW the religion of the killers."

linky linky - http://www.christianpost.com/news/atheist-richard-dawkins-on-paris-terrorist-attack-all-religions-are-not-equally-violent-132281/

He's very good at stating the obvious!  The so called "majority of Peace Loving Muslims, better start taking a stand for what is right.  If citizens of some country were to attack us, wouldn't we hold that country responsible!