There are plenty of obstacles standing in the way of developing the first zero-emission, hydrogen-powered plane. It's tricky to safely store and use the highly combustible fuel. There aren't any airports equipped to refuel jets with it. And the cost of hydrogen itself is prohibitive, at least if you want to avoid producing greenhouse gases.
Yet in September, Airbus SE gave itself five years to develop a commercially viable hydrogen aircraft. The world's biggest planemaker has the backing of its stakeholders—the French, Spanish, and German governments, who have pledged to be carbon neutral by 2050—and billions of euros in government subsidies. Even with help it's going to be a herculean task that will require reinventing the trillion-dollar aviation industry.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-12-04/airbus-air-fp-bets-on-hydrogen-to-deliver-zero-emission-planes
This would be pretty cool if it happens. At the very least maybe we'll get some great technology out of it that can be applied to other forms of transportation.
Quote from: ModelCitizen on December 07, 2020, 09:41:17 AM
There are plenty of obstacles standing in the way of developing the first zero-emission, hydrogen-powered plane. It's tricky to safely store and use the highly combustible fuel. There aren't any airports equipped to refuel jets with it. And the cost of hydrogen itself is prohibitive, at least if you want to avoid producing greenhouse gases.
Yet in September, Airbus SE gave itself five years to develop a commercially viable hydrogen aircraft. The world's biggest planemaker has the backing of its stakeholders—the French, Spanish, and German governments, who have pledged to be carbon neutral by 2050—and billions of euros in government subsidies. Even with help it's going to be a herculean task that will require reinventing the trillion-dollar aviation industry.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-12-04/airbus-air-fp-bets-on-hydrogen-to-deliver-zero-emission-planes
This would be pretty cool if it happens. At the very least maybe we'll get some great technology out of it that can be applied to other forms of transportation.
The canisters used to store hydrogen are extremely heavy, have to be, the smallest atom can escape anything which is not very dense. Wonder if they will carry fewer passengers to compensate for the added weight?
They will charge more, and give even worse service.
:thumbdown:
Quote from: Sick Of Silence on December 09, 2020, 04:34:20 PM
They will charge more, and give even worse service.
:thumbdown:
Air travel is actually pretty cheap, generally speaking.
Wow...I thought liberals and their settled science were making planes electric....
Quote from: ModelCitizen on December 13, 2020, 03:22:29 PM
Air travel is actually pretty cheap, generally speaking.
It used to cost $3-400 to fly to Europe; now they want 5/6 times that plus all the other nickle and dime expenses such as paying for luggage that should be included for that type of price.
:rolleyes:
Quote from: Sick Of Silence on December 13, 2020, 03:46:24 PM
It used to cost $3-400 to fly to Europe; now they want 5/6 times that plus all the other nickle and dime expenses such as paying for luggage that should be included for that type of price.
:rolleyes:
You can consistently find great deals to travel anywhere.
NY to Brazil, for example is just $400+ including taxes
https://www.theflightdeal.com/2020/12/13/american-new-york-rio-de-janeiro-brazil-436-roundtrip-including-all-taxes/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+TheFlightDeal+%28The+Flight+Deal%29
I've seen flights to Europe for $150 - $500
Quote from: Sick Of Silence on December 13, 2020, 03:46:24 PM
It used to cost $3-400 to fly to Europe; now they want 5/6 times that plus all the other nickle and dime expenses such as paying for luggage that should be included for that type of price.
:rolleyes:
Who in their Right mind would fly to fuckin Europe? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Quote from: ModelCitizen on December 13, 2020, 03:54:17 PM
You can consistently find great deals to travel anywhere.
NY to Brazil, for example is just $400+ including taxes
https://www.theflightdeal.com/2020/12/13/american-new-york-rio-de-janeiro-brazil-436-roundtrip-including-all-taxes/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+TheFlightDeal+%28The+Flight+Deal%29
I've seen flights to Europe for $150 - $500
Quote from: Solar on December 13, 2020, 05:46:52 PM
Who in their Right mind would go to fuckin New York? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Quote from: Solar on December 13, 2020, 05:46:52 PM
Who in their Right mind would fly to fuckin Brazil? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Double fixed.
I have no desire to go to New York. I have no desire to go to Brazil.
And, deals on flights are not constant. I usually have to arrange my vacation way in advance. And prices have gone up, and the level of service has gone down.
It doesn't matter what prices are now. Everything is closed down in Europe.
Quote from: Sick Of Silence on December 13, 2020, 09:21:08 PM
Double fixed.
I have no desire to go to New York. I have no desire to go to Brazil.
And, deals on flights are not constant. I usually have to arrange my vacation way in advance. And prices have gone up, and the level of service has gone down.
It doesn't matter what prices are now. Everything is closed down in Europe.
Yeah, aside from the fact Europe is a collective shit hole, you are more restricted than the Bay Area.
Quote from: Possum on December 09, 2020, 04:18:25 PM
The canisters used to store hydrogen are extremely heavy, have to be, the smallest atom can escape anything which is not very dense. Wonder if they will carry fewer passengers to compensate for the added weight?
This can not happen until airports around the world agree with Airbuses wet dream. Which is not going to happen, same reason that you can not go for a drive in the badlands with a Tesla
Quote from: Rockfish on December 30, 2020, 05:52:09 PM
This can not happen until airports around the world agree with Airbuses wet dream. Which is not going to happen, same reason that you can not go for a drive in the badlands with a Tesla
You can't drive in a city with a Tesla either...
The problem with the hydrogen wetdream is that like electric cars the silly asses fail to account for where all the hydrogen comes from. In both cases currently thats largely from oil and other fossil fuels. Fact is all they've managed to do is comup with very inefficent ways to use fossil fuels. This is the kinda shit that happens when the emphasis in our scools turns from science, math and engineering and other worthwhile topics of real benifit to mankind to useless liberal arts bullshit, political correctness and social engineering.
Quote from: dickfoster on January 01, 2021, 01:28:47 PM
The problem with the hydrogen wetdream is that like electric cars the silly asses fail to account for where all the hydrogen comes from. In both cases currently thats largely from oil and other fossil fuels. Fact is all they've managed to do is comup with very inefficent ways to use fossil fuels. This is the kinda shit that happens when the emphasis in our scools turns from science, math and engineering and other worthwhile topics of real benifit to mankind to useless liberal arts bullshit, political correctness and social engineering.
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Welcome Dick, you'll fit Right in. :cool:
Thanks! As a retired engineer I've always had a deep interest in physics and of course economics is always a part of responsible engineering too. :thumbsup:
Quote from: dickfoster on January 01, 2021, 01:41:04 PM
Thanks! As a retired engineer I've always had a deep interest in physics and of course economics is always a part of responsible engineering too. :thumbsup:
Cool, I love people who drive trains. :thumbsup: J/K... :biggrin:
That's one of the few modes of transportation that I have as yet to operate. At this point in my life it's doubtful that I ever will. I'm a retired EE and a silicon valley refugee from the days when there was actually silicon in silicon valley.
Quote from: dickfoster on January 03, 2021, 10:28:46 AM
That's one of the few modes of transportation that I have as yet to operate. At this point in my life it's doubtful that I ever will. I'm a retired EE and a silicon valley refugee from the days when there was actually silicon in silicon valley.
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
One issues I have always had with the idea of a hydrogen driven economy is the side effect of increased humidity in the air. We know that the majority of the atmosphere is water vapor.
No, I don't buy the AGW scam for a moment, but wouldn't this create the probability of increasing trapped heat, increased rainfall across the globe?
Not that either is bad, except for the fact I personally despise humid climates. :biggrin:
Of course this is assuming the entire planet converted to hydrogen. I'd love for someone to do the math on this...
If anything it would likely have a positive effect given the rate that the rainforests are being chopped down. Compared to nature and how the earths geology works our efforts are fairly pathetic compared to say what a single volcano can do.