[size=-1]A USA Today/Gallup survey released Wednesday indicates that 61 percent of the public would oppose a move in their state to pass a bill that would take away some of the collective bargaining rights of union government workers, with one in three saying they'd support such a move.
Wow huh....
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2011/02/23/poll-majority-oppose-stripping-govt-workers-bargaining-rights/ (http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2011/02/23/poll-majority-oppose-stripping-govt-workers-bargaining-rights/)
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Quote from: zip on March 05, 2011, 09:33:02 AM
[size=-1]A USA Today/Gallup survey released Wednesday indicates that 61 percent of the public would oppose a move in their state to pass a bill that would take away some of the collective bargaining rights of union government workers, with one in three saying they'd support such a move.
Wow huh....
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2011/02/23/poll-majority-oppose-stripping-govt-workers-bargaining-rights/ (http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2011/02/23/poll-majority-oppose-stripping-govt-workers-bargaining-rights/)
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Ok, so how many of these people polled were Democrats? How many of these polled were public sector employees? How many of those polled were Republicans? How many of those polled were independents? How many of those polled were private sector workers?
Zip, is this to do with WI or just that you are wanting to prove a different point? I am curious.
I seriously wonder how many people polled even knew what collective bargaining means?
Quote from: U_Kay on March 05, 2011, 10:45:45 AM
Ok, so how many of these people polled were Democrats? How many of these polled were public sector employees? How many of those polled were Republicans? How many of those polled were independents? How many of those polled were private sector workers?
Zip, is this to do with WI or just that you are wanting to prove a different point? I am curious.
I seriously wonder how many people polled even knew what collective bargaining means?
Ukay you must be having trouble understanding my post...I posted polls by reputable Polsters most of which normally lean to the right...You can add any nuances you choose you can even say the polls are wrong...but they are not. i know you dont want it to be so...you want the whole country to ohhhhraaaah sticking it to public workers...but thats not happening and it wont....theres more working class in this country than there are working class users
H
Quote from: U_Kay on March 05, 2011, 10:45:45 AM
Ok, so how many of these people polled were Democrats? How many of these polled were public sector employees? How many of those polled were Republicans? How many of those polled were independents? How many of those polled were private sector workers?
Zip, is this to do with WI or just that you are wanting to prove a different point? I am curious.
I seriously wonder how many people polled even knew what collective bargaining means?
Here ya go...
(https://conservativepoliticalforum.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fsas-origin.onstreammedia.com%2Forigin%2Fgallupinc%2FGallupSpaces%2FProduction%2FCms%2FPOLL%2Fbdutrxdma0migq4uykkknq.gif&hash=5fc0b780612563fd535a0549265d14d46db0dcd0)
Quote from: zip on March 05, 2011, 09:33:02 AM
[size=-1]A USA Today/Gallup survey released Wednesday indicates that 61 percent of the public would oppose a move in their state to pass a bill that would take away some of the collective bargaining rights of union government workers, with one in three saying they'd support such a move.
Wow huh....
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2011/02/23/poll-majority-oppose-stripping-govt-workers-bargaining-rights/ (http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2011/02/23/poll-majority-oppose-stripping-govt-workers-bargaining-rights/)
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Zip, above is what you posted. What is it about this poll that has you posting similar threads in the forum? Perhaps I am not following your logic. Why should all states deal with collective bargaining presently in their states? Some states have surpluses while others are broke. Collective bargaining is a means where by the public worker can come together as a group to bargain with their employer for better raises, benefits, etc... Right? I admit I am not a union worker. I also know only 1 person who is a union worker.
We havent any problems down here in the agriculture world of the South concerning this issue.
Also, I have asked numerous people if they have ever been polled on political issues such as this one. The South is completely ignored so it seems.
I bet there would be quite a few people asking~ "What is collective bargaining?"... if the South was polled. These pollsters probably include 1 Southerner per every 1000 people polled. It is only speculation on my part and I admit it.
Solar, are you sure that graph answers my questions although I found it interesting. Thanks!
Exactly, Solar. Just glance down the left-most column of the chart you lifted from zip's article, and the stunning brilliance, the incandescent genius of the Democrat Party shines forth...
We must not cut programs.
We must not cut pay or benefits for state workers.
We must not raise taxes.
This is the equivalent of saying, "We must not balance the budget."
Also, the poll in general was pretty well split on the issues. The one apparently divisive question that zip is leaning on the hardest -- and the one that provided the USAToday headline (no surprise) -- is with regard to proposals to limit collective bargaining. BUT the question is worded so that it mentions Wisconsin by name, it mentions "teachers" specifically as a group that would be affected (but not others such as highway workers or DMV personnel or SEIU or AFSCME members), and it refers to collective bargaining as "rights" that the legislature is seeking to "take away."
xactly, Solar. Just glance down the left-most column of the chart you lifted from zip's article, and the stunning brilliance, the incandescent genius of the Democrat Party shines forth...
We must not cut programs.
We must not cut pay or benefits for state workers.
We must not raise taxes.
Oh yes yes yes tbone we should use the brilliance of the far right nutjob new teaparty republicans instead....Huge deep tax cuts for the rich..higher subsidies for corporations that dont need them and are making huge profits like the oil industry then the MAINSTAY of their brilliance strip workers of pensions benefits and cut their pay....lol...yeah sure ok...next your going to tell me how cutting taxs for the richest america creates jobs right ??? ROFL thats a fairy tell for Stuart Varney and Cavuto to tell...no one that gets up everyday and goes to work believes it.
I would really like to know the true motives behind some of you that obviously hate the working class....is it because your rich and dont want to pay taxs...or your just stone cold pricks that dont give a shit about anthing but yourselves...either way something stinks real bad about the way you people think
You better believe one thing...that this attack on workers has lost some long time loyal republican voters..
Quote from: zip on March 05, 2011, 07:16:02 PM
Oh yes yes yes tbone we should use the brilliance of the far right nutjob new teaparty republicans instead....Huge deep tax cuts for the rich..higher subsidies for corporations that dont need them and are making huge profits like the oil industry then the MAINSTAY of their brilliance strip workers of pensions benefits and cut their pay....lol...yeah sure ok...next your going to tell me how cutting taxs for the richest america creates jobs right ??? ROFL thats a fairy tell for Stuart Varney and Cavuto to tell...no one that gets up everyday and goes to work believes it.
I would really like to know the true motives behind some of you that obviously hate the working class....is it because your rich and dont want to pay taxs...or your just stone cold pricks that dont give a shit about anthing but yourselves...either way something stinks real bad about the way you people think
You better believe one thing...that this attack on workers has lost some long time loyal republican voters..
For Christ sake Zip, where do you get this Shit????
Prove that statement!!
I want proof of your allegation against the Tea Party!
Quote from: Solar on March 05, 2011, 07:39:47 PM
For Christ sake Zip, where do you get this Shit? ???
Prove that statement!!
I want proof of your allegation against the Tea Party!
Solar I told you I dont have to prove anything..all I have to do is believe it myself.
Quote from: zip on March 05, 2011, 10:36:43 PM
Solar I told you I dont have to prove anything..all I have to do is believe it myself.
The problem is you are posting it as fact, and for that I will continue to call you on it, because as much as you hate being called it, you are a Liar! You personally insulted me as a Tea Party member.
Now don't run off with your tail tucked because you have been called on facts, we are not just an opinion forum like LNF, we are a Fact Forum, so when someone makes a slanderous comment against a group, they better be prepared to back it up and not simply claim it is an opinion.
Quote from: zip on March 05, 2011, 10:36:43 PM
Solar I told you I dont have to prove anything..all I have to do is believe it myself.
Cool! Our first liberal!!!
Quote from: taxed on March 06, 2011, 11:43:00 AM
Cool! Our first liberal!!!
So he has move for RINO and now he or first 100% liberal poster. Now that your out of the closet, how do you feel Zip?
Quote from: taxed on March 06, 2011, 11:43:00 AM
Cool! Our first liberal!!!
Its never about facts.
Its all about the emotion and feelings.
Isn't that what liberals always say?
I do not know where Zip has drawn the conclusion we are rich folks in this forum. Who in here has been bragging of being a rich man/woman?
For the record, Zip... I knew a very wealthy man who gave me some words of wisdom. I shall never forget those words for that rich man has been proven right numerous times...!
The rich ole man once told me... "Kay, anyone bragging he is rich, he is NOT rich! Trust me! A rich man never tells people he is rich! Those who make that claim are only pretending."
On another note~
Zip, we are already taxed enough already...
Quote from: U_Kay on March 06, 2011, 04:27:29 PM
I do not know where Zip has drawn the conclusion we are rich folks in this forum. Who in here has been bragging of being a rich man/woman?
For the record, Zip... I knew a very wealthy man who gave me some words of wisdom. I shall never forget those words for that rich man has been proven right numerous times...!
The rich ole man once told me... "Kay, anyone bragging he is rich, he is NOT rich! Trust me! A rich man never tells people he is rich! Those who make that claim are only pretending."
On another note~
Zip, we are already taxed enough already...
You have to be kinda careful how you say that around here, Kay.... :P :P :P
Zip's just pissed because he keeps running into big hard facts. We sometimes wonder why we hear so much that's misleading or downright untrue in the MSM's reporting, but they have the same problem -- the actual truth, the facts of the matter, don't jive with what they want to see through their rose-colored RayBans.
Taxes? Well, on a federal level, folks with AGI's over $100,000 -- roughly the top 15% of earners -- pay around 75% of all income taxes. Nearly half of "taxpayers" -- 47% -- aren't actually taxpayers at all, because they don't pay any federal income tax; this percentage has increased dramatically since 2007, when only 38% paid no tax. Fully 40% of tax filers make a "profit" on April 15; they qualify for a payment from the IRS, which amounts to a seldom-mentioned federal welfare program.
Quote from: tbone0106 on March 06, 2011, 04:51:55 PM
You have to be kinda careful how you say that around here, Kay.... :P :P :P
Well I am right. I am wondering why I am even working! I was figuring up my self employed taxes for the next quarter... Why am I even working? The Taxes are horrible! I have got to find some loopholes! Maybe a new PC, camera, GPS? I have to think on this!
Quote from: tbone0106 on March 06, 2011, 04:51:55 PM
Zip's just pissed because he keeps running into big hard facts. We sometimes wonder why we hear so much that's misleading or downright untrue in the MSM's reporting, but they have the same problem -- the actual truth, the facts of the matter, don't jive with what they want to see through their rose-colored RayBans.
The MSM has major problems. I remember some time ago when 20 million would watch the nightly news. Wonder why the viewers have fled? They are sick of the MSM's hidden socialist agenda. Agree?
Quote from: tbone0106 on March 06, 2011, 04:51:55 PM
Taxes? Well, on a federal level, folks with AGI's over $100,000 -- roughly the top 15% of earners -- pay around 75% of all income taxes. Nearly half of "taxpayers" -- 47% -- aren't actually taxpayers at all, because they don't pay any federal income tax; this percentage has increased dramatically since 2007, when only 38% paid no tax. Fully 40% of tax filers make a "profit" on April 15; they qualify for a payment from the IRS, which amounts to a seldom-mentioned federal welfare program.
The facts above sound accurate, based on what I have read.
You said, "we are taxed enough already..." That's what I was talking about. I'm surprised our beloved taxed hasn't jumped in on it already! :P :P :P
Quote from: tbone0106 on March 06, 2011, 05:10:03 PM
You said, "we are taxed enough already..." That's what I was talking about. I'm surprised our beloved taxed hasn't jumped in on it already! :P :P :P
I'm worn out on zip. He acts like a child.
Taxed may be resting after a 'big' weekend. :P
Quote from: taxed on March 06, 2011, 05:16:17 PM
I'm worn out on zip. He acts like a child.
It's hard to make any headway when someone comes at you with, "I dont [sic] have to prove anything...I believe it and thats all that counts."
I had a crazy uncle out in California who tried something like that with the IRS years ago, but they didn't see things quite the way he did. Ol' Unc spent some time in the pokey over that one...
Quote from: taxed on March 06, 2011, 05:16:17 PM
I'm worn out on zip. He acts like a child.
Zip wore you out?
or did you go to some wild Mardi Gras party this weekend?
I did and drank a Hurricane! Wow! No more Hurricanes for me!
Quote from: zip on March 05, 2011, 09:33:02 AM
[size=-1]A USA Today/Gallup survey released Wednesday indicates that 61 percent of the public would oppose a move in their state to pass a bill that would take away some of the collective bargaining rights of union government workers, with one in three saying they'd support such a move.
Wow huh....
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2011/02/23/poll-majority-oppose-stripping-govt-workers-bargaining-rights/ (http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2011/02/23/poll-majority-oppose-stripping-govt-workers-bargaining-rights/)
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I have a very hard time believing that 61% of the public even knows the what collective bargaining is.
Quote from: Josie on March 06, 2011, 05:39:10 PM
I have a very hard time believing that 61% of the public even knows the what collective bargaining is.
That's a good point...
Quote from: Josie on March 06, 2011, 05:39:10 PM
I have a very hard time believing that 61% of the public even knows the what collective bargaining is.
You might be right!
I posted earlier in this thread about the poll, and especially about the way that one question was worded -- very carefully! From my earlier post:
Quote from: tbone0106 on March 05, 2011, 02:26:17 PM
Also, the poll in general was pretty well split on the issues. The one apparently divisive question that zip is leaning on the hardest -- and the one that provided the USAToday headline (no surprise) -- is with regard to proposals to limit collective bargaining. BUT the question is worded so that it mentions Wisconsin by name, it mentions "teachers" specifically as a group that would be affected (but not others such as highway workers or DMV personnel or SEIU or AFSCME members), and it refers to collective bargaining as "rights" that the legislature is seeking to "take away."
Any time you ask a large number of Americans if they think it's okay to "take away" the "rights" of a given group of people, you're going to get a LOT of kneejerk no's. The pollsters made no attempt to explain the issue at all; e.g. no mention was made of any budget deficit or of the size of, say, the unfunded public pension obligations. The question was presented as one of a group's "rights" and whether the state should be permitted to "take" those "rights away."
@ Josie~ I totally agree with you! ;)
I thought I said this in another thread but it was in this one....
Quote from: U_Kay on March 05, 2011, 10:45:45 AM
I seriously wonder how many people polled even knew what collective bargaining means?
Quote from: tbone0106 on March 06, 2011, 06:01:16 PM
You might be right!
I posted earlier in this thread about the poll, and especially about the way that one question was worded -- very carefully! From my earlier post:
Any time you ask a large number of Americans if they think it's okay to "take away" the "rights" of a given group of people, you're going to get a LOT of kneejerk no's. The pollsters made no attempt to explain the issue at all; e.g. no mention was made of any budget deficit or of the size of, say, the unfunded public pension obligations. The question was presented as one of a group's "rights" and whether the state should be permitted to "take" those "rights away."
You are absolutely right....
I think republicans have always had a hard time getting the message out....sometimes they give the public too much credit IMO....they need to break things down better and maybe even dumb it down a little and they definately need to talk about it more, like the dems are, even the dems that are in hiding are being interviewed more than republicans...~ I don't think that most Americans are stupid, but there is so much bs and misinformation coming from the other side, especially with the MSM helping the left every chance they get... republicans have to work twice as hard to win hearts and minds....
Quote from: U_Kay on March 06, 2011, 06:06:01 PM
@ Josie~ I totally agree with you! ;)
I thought I said this in another thread but it was in this one....
LOL UK...I need to start reading thru the threads b4 I post, instead of just replying to the OP hehehe
Quote from: Josie on March 06, 2011, 05:39:10 PM
I have a very hard time believing that 61% of the public even knows the what collective bargaining is.
LOL I would say now where I live now 61% don't even know what a union is.
Quote from: Josie on March 06, 2011, 06:38:32 PM
LOL UK...I need to start reading thru the threads b4 I post, instead of just replying to the OP hehehe
Josie, you know what I was thinking when I read your post? Great minds think a lot alike. ;)