Anyone watching this?
Trump is going down!!!
Details?
I have it taping, figured I'd watch it tomorrow morning....wife hates the debates
Quote from: Sauce on February 06, 2016, 06:12:21 PM
Details?
I have it taping, figured I'd watch it tomorrow morning....wife hates the debates
I tuned in late, so I'm not sure of the time frame, but Trump seems to have made himself a target, from borders to imminent domain, and the audience is booing him.
Then on top of that, he turned around and insulted the audience. Not going well.
ABC is doing a good job so far.
Jeb and Kasick need to get a room.
Trump is imploding and Christie has Rubio on the ropes. I dont think I've seen Rubio that rattled in this campaign. Christie killed him on the canned speeches!
Quote from: Bowhntr on February 06, 2016, 07:02:19 PM
Trump is imploding and Christie has Rubio on the ropes. I dont think I've seen Rubio that rattled in this campaign. Christie killed him on the canned speeches!
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
He kicked his ass, that was hilarious!
Cruz had the best closing statement, and then Trump insulted him for it, and got his ass booed.
Trump was his own worst enemy.
Rubio not so much, made some good points but still can't get over his support for illegals.
My take was Cruz and Rubio held about the same, and Trump lost more than anyone on stage.
Bush sucked all the way around, and invoking Reagan was a mistake because it opens him up for his fathers refusal to continue the Reagan Revolution.
Not to mention how he refused to pick up anyone that served in the Reagan administration.
Kasick needs to go away, Christie did fine, but made no gains, he's still a huge RINO.
I'm watching the replay. Christie made Rubio look like an idiot....
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Cruz owned Radditz on N Korea and "talking tough". Nice try Martha.
Best to worst:
Cruz, Christie, Trump, Rubio, Carson, Bush, Kasich.
Waterboarding.. ? Really??
ABC tried predictable 'gotcha' avenues. None of them worked.
Christie took another bite out of Rubio on running away from Gang of Eight....
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
I think Kasich did very well. Rubio got beaten up a bit. Especially by Christie. Cruz was Cruz. Trump seemed deflated. I think Rubio lost a lot of the momentum he had.
Christie is hungry. I think I saw him lick his lips a few times...
Cruz just nails these and looks like the adult. The contrast between he and Rubio or Trump is pretty defined.
Trump outed the RNC having the donors there. That was funny.
Wow. Cruz owned that drug question.
I'm done with Carson. I can't even take his "I'm better than everyone" attitude.
Quote from: taxed on February 06, 2016, 09:31:10 PM
I'm done with Carson. I can't even take his "I'm better than everyone" attitude.
His campaign is going no place...fast. It's the only thing he does quickly. In fact, I heard as of this morning he is the only one still on the stage answering questions from last night. :laugh:
Quote from: taxed on February 06, 2016, 09:31:10 PM
I'm done with Carson. I can't even take his "I'm better than everyone" attitude.
Yeah, that attitude is quickly wearing thin. This is politics, not the hospital, where nurses and staff worship you, instead we see you for what you are, an egotistical jerk with an overt inflated image of yourself, someone way out of their league.
Quote from: Solar on February 07, 2016, 04:51:59 AM
Yeah, that attitude is quickly wearing thin. This is politics, not the hospital, where nurses and staff worship you, instead we see you for what you are, an egotistical jerk with an overt inflated image of yourself, someone way out of their league.
The biggest surprise of the night for me (listening on the radio) - Carson milking and faining outrage, he's done more to undue this 'humble, well reasoned, gentle image' than Trump did before the Iowa debates.
Well, I was expecting (hoping!!!), Trump would completely lose it and stomp off the stage, Microphone in hand... :lol:
Unlike Trump, Cruz apologized - unnecessarily IMO, only because Trump has no ground game but to keep going negative on Cruz. Trump is coasting, nothing positive left to run on.
The real curiosity .. Is Rubio sleeping in the Trump mansion or something? Is Trump trying to hand-off his supporters to Rubio.... and exit? I was listening to radio - where they winking & blowing each other kisses? Footsie between the podiums? Yeeech!
Quote from: kit saginaw on February 06, 2016, 08:14:52 PM
Best to worst:
Cruz, Christie, Trump, Rubio, Carson, Bush, Kasich.
Ditto, I'd add the performance gap between Cruz, Christie ................................................... Trump, Rubio, Carson, Bush, Kasich, quite large. Bush is useful as a "blush" for Rubio - calling him out on Immigration & the gang-of-eight..LOL. Christie is playing it best he can, like Cruz, He'd probably do better with less candidates on stage.
(doesn't mean I'd vote for him).
Dang it!!! I went to sleep just be for the closing statements and woke up as the spin rooms started. Anybody got Cruz's close on video???
Quote from: Bowhntr on February 07, 2016, 07:02:48 AM
Dang it!!! I went to sleep just be for the closing statements and woke up as the spin rooms started. Anybody got Cruz's close on video???
He closed strong and addressed the Iowa ethanol issue head on. Trump took a cheap shot and Cruz didn't take the bait. He made Trump look like the sore loser that he is. He mentioned his victory in Iowa.
Can't seem to find any video.
Here's an annotated transcript:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/02/06/transcript-of-the-feb-6-gop-debate-annotated/
CRUZ: You know, every candidate running for president says they will stand up to Washington. The natural follow up question is when have you ever stood up to Washington.
Last week we saw a powerful illustration of that. I campaigned in the state of Iowa four-square (ph) against the ethanol mandate, something everyone said was political suicide. My two leading competitors both attacked me for it. The governor of the state said vote for anyone but Cruz, and lobbyists spent millions of dollars in attack ads, but I stood and said we should have no mandates, a level playing field, and the people of Iowa put country and our children above the cronyism and corporate welfare...
(BELL RINGING)
CRUZ: ... We can turn this country around if we get back to the Constitution. And, I will always stand with the American people against the bipartisan corruption of Washington.
(APPLAUSE)
Here's cry baby's Trumpertantrum
TRUMP: That's because he got Ben Carson's votes, by the way, but we won't . (inaudible) (The rest is what he says everyday. Never anything new.)
Notice how he always says that he won't say something then he immediately does.
Sorry but he's such as asshole.
Quote from: taxed on February 06, 2016, 09:22:04 PM
Cruz just nails these and looks like the adult. The contrast between he and Rubio or Trump is pretty defined.
Trump outed the RNC having the donors there. That was funny.
Cruz continues to be very steady and makes progress with each debate. Christie exposed Rubio. Trump is trying to run out the clock.
The more I see Rubio, the more I see a kid without control of his emotions. He strikes me as someone that would react without consequence, someone that could easily start WWIII because of uncontrolled petulance.
He just isn't ready for such responsibility.
Cruz on the other hand is far more reserved by his values and core principles in comparison.
Quote from: Solar on February 07, 2016, 09:30:21 AM
The more I see Rubio, the more I see a kid without control of his emotions. He strikes me as someone that would react without consequence, someone that could easily start WWIII because of uncontrolled petulance.
He just isn't ready for such responsibility.
Cruz on the other hand is far more reserved by his values and core principles in comparison.
He's a follower, not a leader.
Quote from: Cruzman on February 07, 2016, 11:55:28 AM
He's a follower, not a leader.
Rubio is more of a puppet to the Establishment than anything.
Quote from: Solar on February 07, 2016, 12:03:57 PM
Rubio is more of a puppet to the Establishment than anything.
And easily misled. The gang of 8.
I completely disagree that Christie gained anything with the exchange with Rubio. Did it bring both of them down? Probably, but Christie just looks like a petulant ass. What was his point, really? That he doesn't like Rubio's answer? That doesn't seem worthy of interrupting seven or eight times.
The only other point he was making is the shopworn notion that somehow governors are better than senators. Repeatedly. If Rubio repeated the Obama line four times, what about Christie repeating that nonsense eight times? He's complaining about Rubio's canned talking points? Give me a break. Christie hasn't said anything thoughtful or original this entire campaign. Christie defines himself as qualified by reference to his many failures. That's Hillary Clinton logic.
Unfortunately, I think people (political talking heads included) are influenced by audience reaction. So Christie was able to pack the audience with his flunkeys and somehow that means he won the debate? The unwarranted applause for Christie and the booing of Rubio just tells you who's people are in the room. That's all.
I think more people rely on "expert" analysis rather than just trusting their own impressions of the debates. Christie won the spin, but it seems to me to be based on nothing. He's still a belligerent, know-nothing fat punk in my book, and did nothing to change that. He had nothing positive to say about his own accomplishments or abilities. How does that add up to a good debate performance?
Quote from: Cali Contrarian on February 07, 2016, 12:17:06 PM
I completely disagree that Christie gained anything with the exchange with Rubio. Did it bring both of them down? Probably, but Christie just looks like a petulant ass. What was his point, really? That he doesn't like Rubio's answer? That doesn't seem worthy of interrupting seven or eight times.
The only other point he was making is the shopworn notion that somehow governors are better than senators. Repeatedly. If Rubio repeated the Obama line four times, what about Christie repeating that nonsense eight times? He's complaining about Rubio's canned talking points? Give me a break. Christie hasn't said anything thoughtful or original this entire campaign. Christie defines himself as qualified by reference to his many failures. That's Hillary Clinton logic.
Unfortunately, I think people (political talking heads included) are influenced by audience reaction. So Christie was able to pack the audience with his flunkeys and somehow that means he won the debate? The unwarranted applause for Christie and the booing of Rubio just tells you who's people are in the room. That's all.
I think more people rely on "expert" analysis rather than just trusting their own impressions of the debates. Christie won the spin, but it seems to me to be based on nothing. He's still a belligerent, know-nothing fat punk in my book, and did nothing to change that. He had nothing positive to say about his own accomplishments or abilities. How does that add up to a good debate performance?
It doesn't matter because Christie's campaign is going nowhere. However once the media gets behind the establishment lackey named Rubio, we all know what happens then. Even Hillary couldn't overcome that when Obama bested her back in 2008 with help from the media. Obama was a vacuous nobody with no accomplishments other than being a community agitator and a brief stint in the Senate. Sound like anyone that we're discussing? That's partly why it was important to take Rubio down a few notches and expose Rubio as an establishment creation. If nothing else he did the voting public a favor by proving just what he was accusing Rubio of...canned speeches and 15 second sound-bytes. The second mistake is to reply on "expert" analysis. The best is to think for oneself. So who had the best debate performance in your opinion? I'd say Cruz and he did it without selling out his principles. Kasich probably helped himself in N.H. but it's over after that. Trump is still a moron and Jeb was finished before he started.
Quote from: Cruzman on February 07, 2016, 12:31:28 PM
It doesn't matter because Christie's campaign is going nowhere. However once the media gets behind the establishment lackey named Rubio, we all know what happens then. Even Hillary couldn't overcome that when Obama bested her back in 2008 with help from the media. Obama was a vacuous nobody with no accomplishments other than being a community agitator and a brief stint in the Senate. Sound like anyone that we're discussing? That's partly why it was important to take Rubio down a few notches and expose Rubio as an establishment creation.
That's how I saw it as well, Christie and Rubot are vying for the same base, both are solid RINO, and neither have a record to run on.
Funny thing is, neither have a shot at the WH, but the Establishment would happily back either one, though at this point their money is on the rookie from Florida.
Quote from: Solar on February 07, 2016, 12:35:41 PM
That's how I saw it as well, Christie and Rubot are vying for the same base, both are solid RINO, and neither have a record to run on.
Funny thing is, neither have a shot at the WH, but the Establishment would happily back either one, though at this point their money is on the rookie from Florida.
There both very controllable RINO's by the RINO GOP and Dems.
Quote from: Solar on February 07, 2016, 12:35:41 PM
That's how I saw it as well, Christie and Rubot are vying for the same base, both are solid RINO, and neither have a record to run on.
Funny thing is, neither have a shot at the WH, but the Establishment would happily back either one, though at this point their money is on the rookie from Florida.
Christie came in handy. He was the "useful idiot" in the debate. :laugh:
Quote from: Cruzman on February 07, 2016, 12:41:09 PM
Christie came in handy. He was the "useful idiot" in the debate. :laugh:
Vying for Kasucks spot as Bush's clingon butt buddy.
Quote from: Solar on February 07, 2016, 12:35:41 PM
That's how I saw it as well, Christie and Rubot are vying for the same base, both are solid RINO, and neither have a record to run on.
Funny thing is, neither have a shot at the WH, but the Establishment would happily back either one, though at this point their money is on the rookie from Florida.
Where does GOPe go if Rubio flames out? By the time it happens the RINO ex-governors will be long gone. Carson and Fiorina will also be gone.
I tuned in the debate late, saw about 40 mins or so and I'm ashamed to admit just as they were done and ready for summations, I nodded off to sleep, My take on it was that the ABC clowns were ignoring Cruz, every question seemed to be Rubio this, that or something else. Then Trump, Then Jeb, then that Buffoon Kasich who I get so tired of talking about how great he did in Ohio in 1979 or something, I saw Jeb and Trump go at it over imminent domain, funny. Glad when Trump got boo'ed.
Quote from: supsalemgr on February 07, 2016, 12:47:31 PM
Where does GOPe go if Rubio flames out? By the time it happens the RINO ex-governors will be long gone. Carson and Fiorina will also be gone.
I really thought they'd keep Fiorina alive as back up, but it looks like they'r all in for the Rubot and Christie knows it and is doing his best to knock him out.
After last night, Rubot might fall hard in the polls, giving Chrusty false hope. :biggrin:
Quote from: supsalemgr on February 07, 2016, 12:47:31 PM
Where does GOPe go if Rubio flames out? By the time it happens the RINO ex-governors will be long gone. Carson and Fiorina will also be gone.
If Jeb beats Rubio the RINO establishment will start backing Jebby again.
Quote from: Solar on February 07, 2016, 12:51:04 PM
I really thought they'd keep Fiorina alive as back up, but it looks like they'r all in for the Rubot and Christie knows it and is doing his best to knock him out.
After last night, Rubot might fall hard in the polls, giving Chrusty false hope. :biggrin:
Same show, different character.
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Here's how the libs saw it at 538.
CANDIDATE AVERAGE GRADE HIGH GRADE LOW GRADE
Chris Christie A- A B+
Jeb Bush B+ A- B
John Kasich B A- C
Donald Trump C+ B C-
Ted Cruz C+ B C-
Marco Rubio C- B D+
Ben Carson C- B- F
http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/we-thought-marco-rubio-lost-the-debate-but-new-hampshire-might-think-differently/
My take, best to worst:
1. Cruz -- Unheralded, but I thought it was his best debate so far. Too bad he was mostly ignored in the 2nd half.
2. Rubio -- The "Rubio choked" narrative is completely unfounded. I could give several reasons why he did well, but for one, his statement about Obama is substantially correct.
3. Bush -- Also his best debate to date.
4. Carson -- His typical mediocrity. He has the best answers on health care though. Too bad he has so much trouble articulating his position -- he's on the right path.
5. Kasich -- Only because Trump and Christie were also in the debate.
6. Trump -- Actually gave a couple of good responses, despite getting embarrassed in the exchange with Bush over eminent domain.
7. Christie -- The Teflon debater. How is this guy never criticized for the constant stream of absurdities, banalities, lies, and outlandish nonsense he spews out every debate? He seems to have a Rasputin-like mind control power over media "analysts" both left and right. The instances are numerous, but just one, that has scarcely been mentioned -- he characterized abortion as an act of "self-defense" against rape. That's normal discourse for Christie, when he's willing to take any position at all, and he's never called on it. Never.
Quote from: Solar on February 07, 2016, 09:30:21 AM
The more I see Rubio, the more I see a kid without control of his emotions. He strikes me as someone that would react without consequence, someone that could easily start WWIII because of uncontrolled petulance.
He just isn't ready for such responsibility.
Cruz on the other hand is far more reserved by his values and core principles in comparison.
He dang sure ought to know what his values are, he tried every way he could with that gang of eight to show us what his values are. Sorry, I just can't visualize him as having any worthy conservative principles and that opinion started when I heard him speak at the Rep Convention when he was guest speaker for Romney. He always talks about his father and how he worked as a bartender in the states and on and on. Anyway, by the end of that speech I was scratching my head. This was in no way what i would have expected him to say when he was talking about citizenship and whatever path he would like to see for illegals. I was thinking that the Romney campaign should have at least picked someone for speaker that wasn't moderate (liberal). Just got a bad taste in my mouth after that speech and then the gang of eight. Rubio the RINO! I'll pass.
Quote from: Cali Contrarian on February 07, 2016, 08:06:20 PM
My take, best to worst:
1. Cruz -- Unheralded, but I thought it was his best debate so far. Too bad he was mostly ignored in the 2nd half.
2. Rubio -- The "Rubio choked" narrative is completely unfounded. I could give several reasons why he did well, but for one, his statement about Obama is substantially correct.
3. Bush -- Also his best debate to date.
4. Carson -- His typical mediocrity.
5. Kasich -- Only because Trump and Christie were also in the debate.
6. Trump -- Actually gave a couple of good responses, despite getting embarrassed in the exchange with Bush over eminent domain.
7. Christie -- The Teflon debater. How is this guy never criticized for the constant stream of absurdities, banalities, lies, and outlandish nonsense he spews out every debate? He seems to have a Rasputin-like mind control power over media "analysts" both left and right. The instances are numerous, but just one, that has scarcely been mentioned -- he characterized abortion as an act of "self-defense" against rape. That's normal discourse for Christie, when he's willing to take any position at all, and he's never called on it. Never.
Do tell! I am curious to here what you have to say. It was obvious to me that he got caught, and just went to his place that he could cling onto, which was about Hussein. He choked pretty bad. Actually, I think he choked way worse than Rick Perry that one debate.
Quote from: taxed on February 07, 2016, 08:12:14 PM
Do tell! I am curious to here what you have to say. It was obvious to me that he got caught, and just went to his place that he could cling onto, which was about Hussein. He choked pretty bad. Actually, I think he choked way worse than Rick Perry that one debate.
Because Christie was way out of line. Rubio doesn't have to make concessions for the sake of Chris Christie's preferences. 90% of the debate responses you hear are mostly pre-packaged bits. It isn't just Rubio. Christie is the worst offender. At least when Rubio gives his set piece, he usually has something to say. Contrast his point about Obama with Christie's typical intrusion into the debate -- "all of that egg-headed policy stuff is what senators talk about, but governors do stuff!" I mean, how inane can you get? Just because you can't follow the conversation, Chris, doesn't mean I can't. Christie is as much an ass and a bore as Trump.
The criticism is way overblown. That's all. Besides, the rest of the debate he was his usual effective self. He has a number of positions I don't agree with, but he makes some good points as well.
Quote from: Cali Contrarian on February 07, 2016, 08:26:45 PM
Because Christie was way out of line. Rubio doesn't have to make concessions for the sake of Chris Christie's preferences. 90% of the debate responses you hear are mostly pre-packaged bits. It isn't just Rubio. Christie is the worst offender. At least when Rubio gives his set piece, he usually has something to say. Contrast his point about Obama with Christie's typical intrusion into the debate -- "all of that egg-headed policy stuff is what senators talk about, but governors do stuff!" I mean, how inane can you get? Just because you can't follow the conversation, Chris, doesn't mean I can't. Christie is as much an ass and a bore as Trump.
The criticism is way overblown. That's all. Besides, the rest of the debate he was his usual effective self. He has a number of positions I don't agree with, but he makes some good points as well.
I agree with everything you said, except I'd give more credit to Christie's timing and political attack. He gave doubt, or at least material to others, that if he can't handle Christie, how's he going to handle Putin or Hillary? For me, I used to think he had the intellectual chops, but I think after last night, I'm not so sure. It's hard getting caught like that. He went into spin-cycle mode like a good little droid, but. he's been outed. I think that was a Rick Perry moment for him. His responses were ladled with self-doubt. It was sad to watch.
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Quote from: taxed on February 07, 2016, 08:37:05 PM
I agree with everything you said, except I'd give more credit to Christie's timing and political attack. He gave doubt, or at least material to others, that if he can't handle Christie, how's he going to handle Putin or Hillary? For me, I used to think he had the intellectual chops, but I think after last night, I'm not so sure. It's hard getting caught like that. He went into spin-cycle mode like a good little droid, but. he's been outed. I think that was a Rick Perry moment for him. His responses were ladled with self-doubt. It was sad to watch.
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Well, almost all of the debate analysis agrees with you, so I won't say there isn't anything to it. I'd just like to see the analysts do more analysis on their own, and less knee-jerk bandwagon consensus.
I think primarily, Rubio gave the response that he did because he didn't want to concede the point, and he had no idea it was going to be perceived the way it has been. He was repeating the point, because if Christie didn't get it, maybe the viewers didn't either, and it was a main thematic point he wanted to make for the debate. I don't draw the conclusion that he can't think on his feet, because I've seen him do it.
I do believe Rubio's momentum has been checked. A lot of factors at play there, not just this incident. I don't see the Rick Perry comparison at all. This may hurt Rubio short term, but I don't think it establishes any unshakable impression in the eyes of the public.
On other side note on the debate I thought was interesting.......
Did anybody else sit up when Kasich promised that he'd get amnesty done for illegals within the first 100 days of his term? As if that would be his top priority or something.
Quote from: Cali Contrarian on February 07, 2016, 08:47:47 PM
Well, almost all of the debate analysis agrees with you, so I won't say there isn't anything to it. I'd just like to see the analysts do more analysis on their own, and less knee-jerk bandwagon consensus.
I think primarily, Rubio gave the response that he did because he didn't want to concede the point, and he had no idea it was going to be perceived the way it has been. He was repeating the point, because if Christie didn't get it, maybe the viewers didn't either, and it was a main thematic point he wanted to make for the debate. I don't draw the conclusion that he can't think on his feet, because I've seen him do it.
I do believe Rubio's momentum has been checked. A lot of factors at play there, not just this incident. I don't see the Rick Perry comparison at all. This may hurt Rubio short term, but I don't think it establishes any unshakable impression in the eyes of the public.
They can patch it up, but Christie took a nice bite out of him. Bush took a little slice out of Trump, which was adorable. I, too, think Cruz won. He also wasn't cheapened on the sister thing because the moderator brought it up. I also agree Rubio's pwnage might not be as seared into our brains like Rick Perry, but it's condensed tight enough in a nice little clip to keep it alive forever. All we have to do is play those Christie clips, and the drinking water thing from the State of the Union, and laughing with Schumer and Menendez on the Gang of 8, and these Rubio fans just completely melt down. When his finances are brought up, that's when it will be interesting. Somebody has to start attacking that.
Quote from: Cali Contrarian on February 07, 2016, 08:51:24 PM
On other side note on the debate I thought was interesting.......
Did anybody else sit up when Kasich promised that
he'd get amnesty done for illegals within the first 100 days of his term?
As if that would be his top priority or something.
Kasich said:
"You must have an agenda that you are ready to move on in the first 100 days.
Jeb is right. If you delay and you wait, the Washington operators will take you down.
I can tell you this, in the first 100 days, I will have legislation to
freeze federal regulations, have them reviewed by the vice president,
reduce state taxes on individuals, (I think he meant estate taxes)
reduce taxes on corporations,
have a fiscal plan to balance the budget,
get the border protected
and begin to fix Social Security in the first 100 days.
"So, anybody who is here tonight, if I get elected president,
head out tomorrow and buy a seat belt,
because there's going to be so much happening in the first 100 days,
it's going to make your head spin.
We're going to move America forward. I promise you.
We're going to move us forward."
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/02/06/transcript-of-the-feb-6-gop-debate-annotated/
Quote from: je_freedom on February 07, 2016, 09:47:59 PM
Kasich said:
"You must have an agenda that you are ready to move on in the first 100 days.
Jeb is right. If you delay and you wait, the Washington operators will take you down.
I can tell you this, in the first 100 days, I will have legislation to
freeze federal regulations, have them reviewed by the vice president,
reduce state taxes on individuals, (I think he meant estate taxes)
reduce taxes on corporations,
have a fiscal plan to balance the budget,
get the border protected
and begin to fix Social Security in the first 100 days.
"So, anybody who is here tonight, if I get elected president,
head out tomorrow and buy a seat belt,
because there's going to be so much happening in the first 100 days,
it's going to make your head spin.
We're going to move America forward. I promise you.
We're going to move us forward."
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/02/06/transcript-of-the-feb-6-gop-debate-annotated/
That's the wrong part of the transcript.
https://youtu.be/EgQJNiyj2p0
Check Kasich's response right around the 42:00 mark.
Quote from: Cali Contrarian on February 07, 2016, 10:17:47 PM
That's the wrong part of the transcript.
https://youtu.be/EgQJNiyj2p0
Check Kasich's response right around the 42:00 mark.
Yup, you got it, Kasich has come out before right around the first or second debate with his support for Amnesty. Thats why he is in the lows and will stay there.
Cruz, after, is the only voice of sanity in that group.
Quote from: Cali Contrarian on February 07, 2016, 10:17:47 PM
That's the wrong part of the transcript.
Check Kasich's response right around the 42:00 mark.
Is this it?
MUIR: Martha, we're going to turn to immigration now. And I want to bring in Governor Kasich because you told us in an ABC interview, Governor, quote, "
It is completely ridiculous to think we are going to go into neighborhoods, grab people out of their homes and ship people back to Mexico." Adding, quote, "
That's not where the party is. The party is not for departing 11.5 million people."
But Mr. Trump and Senator Cruz, who have made deportation central to their campaigns, top the national polls. So, my question for you, are you not where the voters are?
KASICH: Well, you know, David, I -- I've just spent a lot of time here in this state, as I mentioned earlier, and we have to have practical solutions, just like we were just talking about a few minutes ago on North Korea. Look, the situation is, we need to finish the border. It has to be completed. Just like we lock our doors at night, the country has to be able to lock its doors. And we can have a guest worker program, where people can come in and out in an orderly way.
And then for the 11.5 million that are here, if they have not committed a crime since they've been here, I believe they ought to pay some back taxes, pay a fine, never get on the path to citizenship, but get legalization. It is not -- I couldn't even imagine how we would even begin to think about taking a mom or a dad out of a house when they have not committed a crime since they've been here, leaving their children in the house. I mean, that is not, in my opinion, the kind of values that we believe in.
KASICH: And secondly, I think at the end of the day, that Americans would support a plan like this. I think Congress would pass a plan to finish the border, guest worker, pay a fine, a path to legalization, and not citizenship. And we've got to get this done. And I will tell you this, within the first 100 days that I am president, I will put that proposal to the Congress.
And I will tell you, as a former Congressman, and an executive, in Ohio, I can promise you that I believe you'll get the votes to pass that, and we can move on with that issue and protect our border. That's what I think.
The problem with a path to legal residence and not citizenship
is that immediately after the plan is passed,
the Dems will start caterwauling about "second class citizens"
not being allowed to vote, etc.
Quote from: je_freedom on February 08, 2016, 08:38:37 AM
Is this it?
MUIR: Martha, we're going to turn to immigration now. And I want to bring in Governor Kasich because you told us in an ABC interview, Governor, quote, "It is completely ridiculous to think we are going to go into neighborhoods, grab people out of their homes and ship people back to Mexico." Adding, quote, "That's not where the party is. The party is not for departing 11.5 million people."
But Mr. Trump and Senator Cruz, who have made deportation central to their campaigns, top the national polls. So, my question for you, are you not where the voters are?
KASICH: Well, you know, David, I -- I've just spent a lot of time here in this state, as I mentioned earlier, and we have to have practical solutions, just like we were just talking about a few minutes ago on North Korea. Look, the situation is, we need to finish the border. It has to be completed. Just like we lock our doors at night, the country has to be able to lock its doors. And we can have a guest worker program, where people can come in and out in an orderly way.
And then for the 11.5 million that are here, if they have not committed a crime since they've been here, I believe they ought to pay some back taxes, pay a fine, never get on the path to citizenship, but get legalization. It is not -- I couldn't even imagine how we would even begin to think about taking a mom or a dad out of a house when they have not committed a crime since they've been here, leaving their children in the house. I mean, that is not, in my opinion, the kind of values that we believe in.
KASICH: And secondly, I think at the end of the day, that Americans would support a plan like this. I think Congress would pass a plan to finish the border, guest worker, pay a fine, a path to legalization, and not citizenship. And we've got to get this done. And I will tell you this, within the first 100 days that I am president, I will put that proposal to the Congress.
And I will tell you, as a former Congressman, and an executive, in Ohio, I can promise you that I believe you'll get the votes to pass that, and we can move on with that issue and protect our border. That's what I think.
The problem with a path to legal residence and not citizenship
is that immediately after the plan is passed,
the Dems will start caterwauling about "second class citizens"
not being allowed to vote, etc.
Exactly. Also, having millions of people here with no path to citizenship defeats the idea of assimilation. I want immigrants here who desire assimilate and become citizens. Otherwise we are sponsoring another class of inhabitants who are forever excluded.
Getting back to the topic of Rubio's talking point, I cut this from the comments section of a Washington Post news article, from a person posting as "offshore250." This anonymous person makes the case better than I could ever hope to:
I am not "incompetent". I am destroying America more quickly than anyone thought possible.
I am not "in over my head." I am advancing totalitarianism right under your noses.
I am not "stupid". The "stupid" are those who fail to see the danger I bring.
I am not "failing". I am succeeding at every goal I have set.
I am embracing your enemies and rejecting your friends.
I am acting lawlessly and unconstitutionally.
I am ignoring your Constitution.
I am disobeying your laws.
Your media is abetting me.
Your Congress is not stopping me.
Those sworn to defend your Constitution are not removing me.
I am "fundamentally transforming the United States of America."
Your Constitution, liberty, freedom, wealth, future and children are no longer at risk...the risk is past; they already are lost.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Now you tell me, is Christie essentially right or is Rubio?
(aside to taxes) -- I know this does not address the point you made, which is well received.
Quote from: je_freedom on February 08, 2016, 08:38:37 AM
Is this it?
MUIR: Martha, we're going to turn to immigration now. And I want to bring in Governor Kasich because you told us in an ABC interview, Governor, quote, "It is completely ridiculous to think we are going to go into neighborhoods, grab people out of their homes and ship people back to Mexico." Adding, quote, "That's not where the party is. The party is not for departing 11.5 million people."
But Mr. Trump and Senator Cruz, who have made deportation central to their campaigns, top the national polls. So, my question for you, are you not where the voters are?
KASICH: Well, you know, David, I -- I've just spent a lot of time here in this state, as I mentioned earlier, and we have to have practical solutions, just like we were just talking about a few minutes ago on North Korea. Look, the situation is, we need to finish the border. It has to be completed. Just like we lock our doors at night, the country has to be able to lock its doors. And we can have a guest worker program, where people can come in and out in an orderly way.
And then for the 11.5 million that are here, if they have not committed a crime since they've been here, I believe they ought to pay some back taxes, pay a fine, never get on the path to citizenship, but get legalization. It is not -- I couldn't even imagine how we would even begin to think about taking a mom or a dad out of a house when they have not committed a crime since they've been here, leaving their children in the house. I mean, that is not, in my opinion, the kind of values that we believe in.
KASICH: And secondly, I think at the end of the day, that Americans would support a plan like this. I think Congress would pass a plan to finish the border, guest worker, pay a fine, a path to legalization, and not citizenship. And we've got to get this done. And I will tell you this, within the first 100 days that I am president, I will put that proposal to the Congress.
And I will tell you, as a former Congressman, and an executive, in Ohio, I can promise you that I believe you'll get the votes to pass that, and we can move on with that issue and protect our border. That's what I think.
The problem with a path to legal residence and not citizenship
is that immediately after the plan is passed,
the Dems will start caterwauling about "second class citizens"
not being allowed to vote, etc.
Strangely enough, this is what many voters actually heard, despite Cruz repeating it over and over, it never sunk in till a moderator repeated it.
Quote from: Cali Contrarian on February 08, 2016, 09:19:41 AM
Getting back to the topic of Rubio's talking point, I cut this from the comments section of a Washington Post news article, from a person posting as "offshore250." This anonymous person makes the case better than I could ever hope to:
I am not "incompetent". I am destroying America more quickly than anyone thought possible.
I am not "in over my head." I am advancing totalitarianism right under your noses.
I am not "stupid". The "stupid" are those who fail to see the danger I bring.
I am not "failing". I am succeeding at every goal I have set.
I am embracing your enemies and rejecting your friends.
I am acting lawlessly and unconstitutionally.
I am ignoring your Constitution.
I am disobeying your laws.
Your media is abetting me.
Your Congress is not stopping me.
Those sworn to defend your Constitution are not removing me.
I am "fundamentally transforming the United States of America."
Your Constitution, liberty, freedom, wealth, future and children are no longer at risk...the risk is past; they already are lost.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Now you tell me, is Christie essentially right or is Rubio?
(aside to taxes) -- I know this does not address the point you made, which is well received.
It's not a matter of who's right or who's wrong. Christie was pointing out that Rubio is running on a script. A 25 second canned speech. He is pointing this out to show that essentially Rubio is incapable of thinking on his feet and adapting. I would say that Rubio did a VERY good job of proving Christie correct in that light. Christie made him look small, foolish, and very ill prepared other than a catchy little talking point!
Quote from: Bowhntr on February 08, 2016, 10:36:03 AM
It's not a matter of who's right or who's wrong.
Christie was pointing out that Rubio is running on a script.
A 25 second canned speech.
He is pointing this out to show that essentially
Rubio is incapable of thinking on his feet and adapting.
I would say that Rubio did a VERY good job of
proving Christie correct in that light.
Christie made him look small, foolish,
and very ill prepared other than a catchy little talking point!
It matters to me that Rubio is right and Christie is wrong.
Christie is making this argument to divert attention from the fact that
Rubio IS right about the Enemy of America that Christie hugged.
Cruz is also right about The Illegitimate One. He says the same thing.
Plus, he doesn't have Rubio's weak debating skills,
or his treachery on immigration.
Rubio supporters should switch to Cruz and put him over the top!
Quote from: je_freedom on February 08, 2016, 06:46:26 PM
It matters to me that Rubio is right and Christie is wrong.
Christie is making this argument to divert attention from the fact that
Rubio IS right about the Enemy of America that Christie hugged.
Cruz is also right about The Illegitimate One. He says the same thing.
Plus, he doesn't have Rubio's weak debating skills,
or his treachery on immigration.
Rubio supporters should switch to Cruz and put him over the top!
I became fed up with Rubio during the Romney campaign, as I've already stated, because he came off as a rino to me then and he hasn't shaped up any better since. We need to put him in the liberal stable and keep him there.
Quote from: keyboarder on February 08, 2016, 08:17:34 PM
I became fed up with Rubio during the Romney campaign, as I've already stated, because he came off as a rino to me then and he hasn't shaped up any better since. We need to put him in the liberal stable and keep him there.
To me Rubio is an opportunist that would throw in with McConnell if the wind was blowing that way.