Those condescending atheists

[Solar]

Yeah, but I can also understand how people that haven't been taught about God can easily dismiss the concept. Others that have been taught, are receiving a constant barrage from the left, about how stupid it is, and choose to abandon God on their own.
I don't hold it against any of them. Personally, I've had too many things happen in my life for me to believe in anything but God. I don't bother arguing about it, because there is no way I can expain what God is, in scientific terms. I'm pretty sure that the answer would be beyond our comprehension.

That's my whole point, it is well beyond our comprehension, and always will be.
For us to even be discussing this is evidence that something huge occurred, and for something to exist, had to come from somewhere, and that somewhere had to have a point of creation, hence a creator.

This is why I try and hammer into hardcore Atheists heads, that something bigger than us exists, whether they want to worship it or not is irrelevant, simply accepting something bigger than life itself is being spiritual, to do otherwise is pure arrogance in the belief they are all that ever was and will be.

I'm not going to try and define this power, whether it's an all seeing entity, or a flux energy, it does exist.
I don't have faith, I only know what I've seen and that is miracles when I tap into that energy in the form of prayer and talking to God.

I can honestly say, that every time I asked for help, I was never given what I wanted, but actually what I needed, it's why I am where I am today and why my life is "to me" perfect.
I thank, (for loss of better description) God for all I have in my life.

[kramarat]

That's my whole point, it is well beyond our comprehension, and always will be.
For us to even be discussing this is evidence that something huge occurred, and for something to exist, had to come from somewhere, and that somewhere had to have a point of creation, hence a creator.

This is why I try and hammer into hardcore Atheists heads, that something bigger than us exists, whether they want to worship it or not is irrelevant, simply accepting something bigger than life itself is being spiritual, to do otherwise is pure arrogance in the belief they are all that ever was and will be.

I'm not going to try and define this power, whether it's an all seeing entity, or a flux energy, it does exist.
I don't have faith, I only know what I've seen and that is miracles when I tap into that energy in the form of prayer and talking to God.

I can honestly say, that every time I asked for help, I was never given what I wanted, but actually what I needed, it's why I am where I am today and why my life is "to me" perfect.
I thank, (for loss of better description) God for all I have in my life.

One of the things that gets me into trouble with fellow Christians, is my refusal to condemn those that practice other religions; particularly Buddhism, Hinduism, and even the shamanism that is practiced in certain indigenous tribes.

While I accept Jesus and the Bible as my personal path to God; I also believe that God has revealed Himself to others in different ways. I don't believe that Gandhi will burn in hell for his teachings. A lot of people think that is blasphemy.

[Solar]

One of the things that gets me into trouble with fellow Christians, is my refusal to condemn those that practice other religions; particularly Buddhism, Hinduism, and even the shamanism that is practiced in certain indigenous tribes.

While I accept Jesus and the Bible as my personal path to God; I also believe that God has revealed Himself to others in different ways. I don't believe that Gandhi will burn in hell for his teachings. A lot of people think that is blasphemy.

I totally agree!
And what about those that have never heard the word, are they destined to burn in the eternal fire?

My God is not so vindictive. I believe Jesus is just one of paths, one God gave us, it is those that repeat the word that there is only one path to salvation, I honestly believe Jesus would have something to say about that if he were here today.

I'm not trying to insult Christian believers in anyway, it's just that somewhere along the way during the Crusades, the true meaning has been mangled.

For the same reason a wrathful God has been expunged from most teachings in the last century, I believe the Church will do the same with the teaching that to not be Christian, one is doomed to Hell.

It's for this very reason I left the Church 30 years ago.

[Yawn]

One of the things that gets me into trouble with fellow Christians, is my refusal to condemn those that practice other religions; particularly Buddhism, Hinduism, and even the shamanism that is practiced in certain indigenous tribes.

While I accept Jesus and the Bible as my personal path to God; I also believe that God has revealed Himself to others in different ways. I don't believe that Gandhi will burn in hell for his teachings. A lot of people think that is blasphemy.

Your problem is that you reject the words of "Jesus."  I don't "condemn" them either. Neither does God. But IF you call yourself "Christian," is it reasonable that I can "debate" the issues (doctrines) FROM THE SCRIPTURES?

"Jesus" (you do understand that was not His name) said, "No man can come to the Father EXCEPT through Me."--John 14:6

I don't believe that Gandhi will burn in hell for his teachings. A lot of people think that is blasphemy.

The Bible doesn't teach that. "Judgment begins with the House of God"

The CHURCH is being judged (as far as Eternal Life) at this time. Gandhi (who committed incest with his nieces) ISN'T BEING JUDGED UNTIL AFTER THE RESURRECTION.  99% aren't being judged at this time--ONLY the Church of God.

What I'm seeing in your give-and-take with Solar in bashing Christians originates in your acceptance of those Pagan influences in the Church the Bible calls the Great Whore and the Daughters of the Whore (Catholicism and Protestantism). It's that spreading of LIES and False Doctrine that motivates me to speak out against those organizations.

There IS a final punishment in the Lake of Fire. It is DEATH--not eternal torture.  Those who have not been "called" in this life are not being judged. Their time comes after the Resurrection at the end of the 1,000 year Reign of Christ ON EARTH.

[Yawn]

Why do so many worship this man Gandhi?

This article discusses the sexual antics of Gandhi, and it sheds light on his political and personal failures. It highlights his strange habits of urine drinking, and love for enemas. He brings out the facts about his consumption of his own piss, and his drinking of Holy Cow urine. The article lists Mr. Gandhis pedophilia incest, adultery, weird fetishes, and sexual perversion. Our article presents solid proof and well research supporting documentation on these and other issues. The following site lists all material in one place. (The Truth about Mohandas Gandhi). http://rupeenews.com/2011/12/the-evil-in-mr-mohnadas-gandhi/ 

[kramarat]

Why do so many worship this man Gandhi?

I was talking about this guy:

http://sonekichidiya.in/your-platform-to-reform-india-lets-join-hands-and-do-it-january-2013-announcing-a-total-reform-movement/mahatma-gandhi/

I'm not up to the task tonight, but we'll continue this conversation. I see your quickness to condemn others as a drawback on your Christianity. Did God place you here to pass judgement?

[anti-American]

We're here, therefore something created us, hence a creator.
Why is this so hard for people to grasp?

That's terrible logic. How about this: There's a creator, something created it, hence a super-creator.

I'm not even talking about life, I was talking about existence in general, the fact that there is even something in existence, space or matter. Something had to create it.
Then add to that life, one has to be a fool to think all this is an accident, accidents require two ententes for it to happen, otherwise there would be nothing.

For every action, there's a reaction, something created the first action.

What created the creator? If we need to be created then surely something great enough to create us would also need to be created. I have asked this many times in many ways but nobody seems to want to answer it.

[Solar]

That's terrible logic. How about this: There's a creator, something created it, hence a super-creator.

What created the creator? If we need to be created then surely something great enough to create us would also need to be created. I have asked this many times in many ways but nobody seems to want to answer it.

Your logic is flawed, or are you actually admitting we were created?

I think you are putting way too much thought into what may have created us, the fact that we exist at all means we were created by something, but no one knows why or by what and for what reason, but our mere existence is proof of something beyond our limited comprehension.

[JustKari]

That's terrible logic. How about this: There's a creator, something created it, hence a super-creator.

What created the creator? If we need to be created then surely something great enough to create us would also need to be created. I have asked this many times in many ways but nobody seems to want to answer it.

Actually, God is timeless He always was and always will be.  This is "illogical" to you because from a very young age you have been taught that time matters. 

Some people (not necessarily me) think of time as a giant circle.  There is no need for a Super-Creator, God is/was more than capable.

[Solar]

Actually, God is timeless He always was and always will be.  This is "illogical" to you because from a very young age you have been taught that time matters. 

Some people (not necessarily me) think of time as a giant circle.  There is no need for a Super-Creator, God is/was more than capable.

That's the thing, time is a human construct, a barrier to human intellect limiting mans ability to understand the infinite possibility that life is far different beyond our realm of understanding.
Something I believe was purposefully put in place so man could experience life without understanding the meaning why we were placed here.
If we had all the answers, we probably wouldn't want to be here. Life is tough for a reason, it is meant to expand our understanding of our deeper meaning in the spirit world.
Be it Heaven or whatever someone wants to call it, it is a gift no matter how it's viewed and it was given to us by our creator.

Understanding life is not what we were sent here for, but rather to experience something we are incapable of realizing in the spirit world, meaning, the tangible of love, hate and everything in between.

Of course this is my interpretation, but after a lifetime of witnessing miracles, I can only conclude this to be only one possibility of real life, there are many yet to come.

[MFA]

What created the creator? If we need to be created then surely something great enough to create us would also need to be created. I have asked this many times in many ways but nobody seems to want to answer it.

I don't mean to sound condescending, but the question implies a lack of understanding about what is meant by the term "God."  God is by definition "uncreated."

[taxed]

That's terrible logic. How about this: There's a creator, something created it, hence a super-creator.

What created the creator? If we need to be created then surely something great enough to create us would also need to be created. I have asked this many times in many ways but nobody seems to want to answer it.

Are you holding the creation of the universe to that same standard, i.e., was the universe always, or did it create out of nothing?  Do this: pretend God is the universe.  Now, was he always here, or was it created?

[TboneAgain]

That's the thing, time is a human construct, a barrier to human intellect limiting mans ability to understand the infinite possibility that life is far different beyond our realm of understanding.
Something I believe was purposefully put in place so man could experience life without understanding the meaning why we were placed here.
If we had all the answers, we probably wouldn't want to be here. Life is tough for a reason, it is meant to expand our understanding of our deeper meaning in the spirit world.
Be it Heaven or whatever someone wants to call it, it is a gift no matter how it's viewed and it was given to us by our creator.

Understanding life is not what we were sent here for, but rather to experience something we are incapable of realizing in the spirit world, meaning, the tangible of love, hate and everything in between.

Of course this is my interpretation, but after a lifetime of witnessing miracles, I can only conclude this to be only one possibility of real life, there are many yet to come.

Time is hardly a human construct. Men have found ways and standards to quantify time, to understand it and express the way it affects our lives, but I'm pretty sure it exists with or without man. I'm pretty sure that time is a valid concept anywhere in the universe, in a trillion places man has never seen -- and will never see. Even the most radical concepts in the world of physics include time as a constant.

But religion, in all its forms, is very much a human construct. I read just the other day that there are something like 41,000 different denominations of the Christian faith alone. Of course, most of them share some basic principles -- God as Master and Creator, Christ as crucified and resurrected Savior, redemption through Christ, and so on -- but beyond that there are thousands of variations. Even using the same Scripture -- itself a book created and heavily edited through the ages by man -- as a basis hasn't resulted in a monolithic church.

There is no monolithic church because religion is not monolithic, and can never be. I think religion in general is a way for practical rules of living to become "law" without (in some cases) becoming actual law. The Ten Commandments are a prime example of what I'm talking about. "Thou shalt not kill" is obviously a principle that has been codified into civil and criminal law practically everywhere on Earth. We like to see such laws and commandments as "moral" rules, but the fact is they're aimed at preserving the species, plain and simple. (Of course, morality in general is also a uniquely human construct.)

But where is "Honor thy father and thy mother" made into civil law? As a principle, it makes perfect sense, and everyone would agree that it's a good thing to do... but how do you make it into law? You don't. Instead, you make it part of a religion, and enshrine it with morality. If you don't honor Mom and Dad, you won't go to jail (probably), but you're BAD nevertheless. You just might go to Hell when you leave this world.

"Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's wife" is another good example of what I'm saying. These days, legally, you can covet your neighbor's wife all you want -- and slip over there when the neighbor's gone and help yourself -- and nobody gets in trouble with the law. But obviously, sooner or later the shit will hit the fan, and very bad things will happen. Again, you haven't broken a civil or criminal law, but you've been BAD, and may have earned a one-way ticket across the River Styx.

Honoring your parents and turning away from your bikini-clad neighbor lady are examples of things that are SMART LIVING. They are things that help you get through life. They're hard to put into the rigid confines of human civil or criminal law, but they're easy to incorporate into a faith-based religion.

THAT, I think is what religion is for. The political power doesn't work well in some ways, but the power of God, and the threat of Hell, is meant to put these principles into play.

[kramarat]

Time is hardly a human construct. Men have found ways and standards to quantify time, to understand it and express the way it affects our lives, but I'm pretty sure it exists with or without man. I'm pretty sure that time is a valid concept anywhere in the universe, in a trillion places man has never seen -- and will never see. Even the most radical concepts in the world of physics include time as a constant.

But religion, in all its forms, is very much a human construct. I read just the other day that there are something like 41,000 different denominations of the Christian faith alone. Of course, most of them share some basic principles -- God as Master and Creator, Christ as crucified and resurrected Savior, redemption through Christ, and so on -- but beyond that there are thousands of variations. Even using the same Scripture -- itself a book created and heavily edited through the ages by man -- as a basis hasn't resulted in a monolithic church.

There is no monolithic church because religion is not monolithic, and can never be. I think religion in general is a way for practical rules of living to become "law" without (in some cases) becoming actual law. The Ten Commandments are a prime example of what I'm talking about. "Thou shalt not kill" is obviously a principle that has been codified into civil and criminal law practically everywhere on Earth. We like to see such laws and commandments as "moral" rules, but the fact is they're aimed at preserving the species, plain and simple. (Of course, morality in general is also a uniquely human construct.)

But where is "Honor thy father and thy mother" made into civil law? As a principle, it makes perfect sense, and everyone would agree that it's a good thing to do... but how do you make it into law? You don't. Instead, you make it part of a religion, and enshrine it with morality. If you don't honor Mom and Dad, you won't go to jail (probably), but you're BAD nevertheless. You just might go to Hell when you leave this world.

"Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's wife" is another good example of what I'm saying. These days, legally, you can covet your neighbor's wife all you want -- and slip over there when the neighbor's gone and help yourself -- and nobody gets in trouble with the law. But obviously, sooner or later the shit will hit the fan, and very bad things will happen. Again, you haven't broken a civil or criminal law, but you've been BAD, and may have earned a one-way ticket across the River Styx.

Honoring your parents and turning away from your bikini-clad neighbor lady are examples of things that are SMART LIVING. They are things that help you get through life. They're hard to put into the rigid confines of human civil or criminal law, but they're easy to incorporate into a faith-based religion.

THAT, I think is what religion is for. The political power doesn't work well in some ways, but the power of God, and the threat of Hell, is meant to put these principles into play.

Do you believe that the old and new testament, as well as the other books that relate to God and Christ, are fictional constructs of the human mind?

If yes; why would people go to that much trouble?

[Solar]

Time is hardly a human construct. Men have found ways and standards to quantify time, to understand it and express the way it affects our lives, but I'm pretty sure it exists with or without man. I'm pretty sure that time is a valid concept anywhere in the universe, in a trillion places man has never seen -- and will never see. Even the most radical concepts in the world of physics include time as a constant.

But religion, in all its forms, is very much a human construct. I read just the other day that there are something like 41,000 different denominations of the Christian faith alone. Of course, most of them share some basic principles -- God as Master and Creator, Christ as crucified and resurrected Savior, redemption through Christ, and so on -- but beyond that there are thousands of variations. Even using the same Scripture -- itself a book created and heavily edited through the ages by man -- as a basis hasn't resulted in a monolithic church.

There is no monolithic church because religion is not monolithic, and can never be. I think religion in general is a way for practical rules of living to become "law" without (in some cases) becoming actual law. The Ten Commandments are a prime example of what I'm talking about. "Thou shalt not kill" is obviously a principle that has been codified into civil and criminal law practically everywhere on Earth. We like to see such laws and commandments as "moral" rules, but the fact is they're aimed at preserving the species, plain and simple. (Of course, morality in general is also a uniquely human construct.)

But where is "Honor thy father and thy mother" made into civil law? As a principle, it makes perfect sense, and everyone would agree that it's a good thing to do... but how do you make it into law? You don't. Instead, you make it part of a religion, and enshrine it with morality. If you don't honor Mom and Dad, you won't go to jail (probably), but you're BAD nevertheless. You just might go to Hell when you leave this world.

"Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's wife" is another good example of what I'm saying. These days, legally, you can covet your neighbor's wife all you want -- and slip over there when the neighbor's gone and help yourself -- and nobody gets in trouble with the law. But obviously, sooner or later the shit will hit the fan, and very bad things will happen. Again, you haven't broken a civil or criminal law, but you've been BAD, and may have earned a one-way ticket across the River Styx.

Honoring your parents and turning away from your bikini-clad neighbor lady are examples of things that are SMART LIVING. They are things that help you get through life. They're hard to put into the rigid confines of human civil or criminal law, but they're easy to incorporate into a faith-based religion.

THAT, I think is what religion is for. The political power doesn't work well in some ways, but the power of God, and the threat of Hell, is meant to put these principles into play.

Sorry, I kind of glazed over and ...
Oh, this went right over your head, didn't it?
Time is definitely a human construct, if man were not here, it wouldn't exist.
Kind of like a tree falling in the forest, if no one heard it, it made no discernible noise.

Point is, the Universe was created solely for our existence, all life.
I know, that sounds vain, but look at it this way, if time did not exist, the big bang would look like a big explosion, or implosion, depending on the theory you prefer.
But slow it down to near stop frame, and throw life into the mix, now we have a place of existence.

From my years of researching the subject, when we die, all those that went before us, will greet us as if they had just finished life here on Earth as well, in fact when we're gone, the Universe will no longer exist, because time does not exist on the other side.
Time is merely a flash in the pan.

You are trying to understand life as wee know it from a human perspective, which by comparison, is that of the ant trying to understand infinity, the concept is far beyond their comprehension, as is life and the universe to us.

Do you really think matter ,physics, algebra, water, etc matter to us after we're gone?
Of course not, it is the here and now, it is all slowed down solely for our existence, or rather all life through out the known expanse beyond us.

Is that too deep?