Quote from: Just_the_facts_mamm on January 31, 2012, 10:00:00 AM
So based on the FOX news report, "Fast and Furious" dates back to well inside the Bush administration.
Tell me again why this is the Obama's administrations fault?

Revenge on Jan Brewer by GW Bush?  DO the GOP have no loyalty?

Two years under W, three years under Obama.  Got it?  Get your head out of the sand.

Quote from: Just_the_facts_mamm on February 03, 2012, 11:16:53 PM
let's not try to put words in my mouth.
You cons try to pin the thing solely on Obama. I was pointing out  that the operation started with Bush.

But seriously people, you think for a second anyone involved in this was intentionally letting guns go to bad guys?

It's not like Obama is a low as Ron Reagan who was trading guns for drugs

The I will assume your are also birthers and "Muslim president" advocates as well.
Sad

Oh jeez, more lib history realignment, but I'll ignore that at the moment because I'm sure I'll educate you on the subject at a later date.
No, we do not think he wanted the guns to go where they did, but it is just more evidence of incompetence and cover up in the worst run administration in history.
We have a child POTUS and a Cabinet full of children that hate the country and want to fundamentally change it.

Quote from: Just_NO_facts_mamm on February 03, 2012, 11:16:53 PM
let's not try to put words in my mouth.
You cons try to pin the thing solely on Obama. I was pointing out  that the operation started with Bush.

What does this have to do with Holder lying and covering it up?

Quote
But seriously people, you think for a second anyone involved in this was intentionally letting guns go to bad guys?

Yes.  Hussein and Holder are anti-American.

Quote
It's not like Obama is a low as Ron Reagan who was trading guns for drugs

Reagan actually didn't know about it.

Quote
The I will assume your are also birthers and "Muslim president" advocates as well.
Sad

Obama: "My Muslim Faith"

Quote from: taxed on February 04, 2012, 06:28:46 AM
What does this have to do with Holder lying and covering it up?

well TAXED you are going to have to PROVE there was a coverup AND NOT with a conservative foil hat site!
sounds like Propaganda, looks like propaganda, It IS propaganda!

Quote from: taxed on February 04, 2012, 06:28:46 AM
Yes.  Hussein and Holder are anti-American.

Smells like political vomit, looks like political vomit, It IS(you know the rest)
What do you base this on?

your spot on intuition?

Rush Limpduck told you?

Quote from: taxed on February 04, 2012, 06:28:46 AM
Reagan actually didn't know about it.

Now here we can agree. The man had Alzheimer's  for gods sake.

He was not cognizant of the last term in office!

BUT it was a GOP administration that DID it!

Kind of like Nixon DID it!
GOP have a history of being inappropriate, with their high position of power!

The guns were lost under Eric Holders department. Not Bush's. The gun that killed Officer Terry was put on the street by the Holder Justice Department.

 I was just reading these replies and wondering, "Whatever happened to the Truman thinking that 'the buck stops here'?"

It seems that the dem thinking is that the buck stops way down the totem poll if a high level dem is involved in something that goes awry.   Their plan is if you can find a rep to blame, go for it.  Ridiculous.  As C-I-C the dems say "Obama got bin laden", when all he did was say "Okey dokey" to a plan that the Navy Seals had, and the Seals got bin laden.  But heaven forbid that the buck should stop high up if the buck is counterfit and the admin still uses it.  Obama and his admin aren't much into taking responsibility unless they know the outcome is favorable to them.  Twits, every one of them.

Quote from: crepe05 on February 05, 2012, 03:08:20 PM
I was just reading these replies and wondering, "Whatever happened to the Truman thinking that 'the buck stops here'?"

I have provided a quote showing he does accept responsibility.

Please back up your claim that he DOES NOT accept responsibility!
You cons are so desperate to find SOMETHING wrong with the Obama administration, you are grasping at the smallest straws.

Quote from: crepe05 on February 05, 2012, 03:08:20 PM
But heaven forbid that the buck should stop high up if the buck is counterfit and the admin still uses it.  Obama and his admin aren't much into taking responsibility unless they know the outcome is favorable to them.  Twits, every one of them.

Let me explain it for you.

The gun issue,
you cons like to portray it like Holder drove down there and put the guns in the bad guys hands.
How many different people are involved in the chain of command  on a program in effect for years before he took over.

Quote
The operation's goal was to follow the gun supply chain from small-time gun buyers at a number of Phoenix-area gun shops and make cases against major weapons traffickers. In the process, federal agents lost track of many of the more than 2,000 guns linked to the operation. Two of the guns purchased at a Phoenix gun store were recovered from the scene of a shooting that killed border agent Brian Terry on the U.S. side of the border.

Smith said many questions remain about who authorized the operation.

"We do not know who the particular person was" who decided that "this flawed operation should be conducted," Holder said.

Amid probes by Republicans in Congress and the Justice Department's inspector general, the department already has replaced U.S. Attorney Dennis Burke in Phoenix, acting ATF Director Kenneth Melson and the lead prosecutor in Operation Fast and Furious.

Holder said he is prepared to take other steps, with additional personnel changes possible. The inspector general's office at the Justice Department is investigating what went wrong in Operation Fast and Furious, but "that does not lessen the responsibility I have as head manager," he said.


Holder said he is prepared to take other steps, with additional personnel changes possible. The inspector general's office at the Justice Department is investigating what went wrong in Operation Fast and Furious, but "that does not lessen the responsibility I have as head manager," he said.

Operation Fast and Furious was "a regional operation" and not "top to bottom," said Holder. The tactic at issue was not a decision made in Washington, Holder said.

Seriously people, if this the "stained dress"  issue you guys are going to push, well, it's bit week and makes you look desperate.

Quote from: Just_the_facts_mamm on February 05, 2012, 04:35:23 PM
I have provided a quote showing he does accept responsibility.

Please back up your claim that he DOES NOT accept responsibility!
You cons are so desperate to find SOMETHING wrong with the Obama administration, you are grasping at the smallest straws.

Everything he has done is wrong!
The economy would be sailing along had he simply got Gov out of the way and let the free mkt do what it does best.
But he did not, he placed barriers up, he caused the price of energy to increase, he is closing coal plants and putting people out of work.
Yeah, he's doing a bang up job.

QuoteLet me explain it for you.

The gun issue,
you cons like to portray it like Holder drove down there and put the guns in the bad guys hands.
How many different people are involved in the chain of command  on a program in effect for years before he took over.Seriously people, if this the "stained dress"  issue you guys are going to push, well, it's bit week and makes you look desperate.

Lying about knowing about it is kind of a give away that he knew he had screwed up.
And people like you enable these liars to continue to screw up.
Quit carrying their water for them.

Quote from: Solar on February 05, 2012, 04:49:15 PM
Everything he has done is wrong!

The economy would be sailing along had he simply got Gov out of the way and let the free mkt do what it does best.

SO that would be one conservative guys opinion, now show me some evidence to that effect!
more flapping gums.

We could have been stuck with McCains plan?  He thought the economy was fine THE DAY BEFORE THE CRASH!

But GOP are on the ball, right??

Economists say that without the stimulus we would have unemployment 1 or 2 points higher.

Oh and should the banks have collapsed as well? Just curious.

Quote from: Solar on February 05, 2012, 04:49:15 PM
But he did not, he placed barriers up, he caused the price of energy to increase, he is closing coal plants and putting people out of work.

SO now you are going to have to prove to me WHAT barriers he put UP, HOW he increased energy prices (that are controlled by OPEC)
an article about coal plants and joblessness, which I know is an issue but so is CLIMATE CHANGE. but that's a different thread.

I thought we have a rule about not flapping your gums without some kind of proof?

Most of what you state above, is mere conjecture by some right wing extremists.

Quote from: Just_the_facts_mamm on February 05, 2012, 05:54:12 PM
SO that would be one conservative guys opinion, now show me some evidence to that effect!
more flapping gums.

We could have been stuck with McCains plan?  He thought the economy was fine THE DAY BEFORE THE CRASH!

But GOP are on the ball, right??

Economists say that without the stimulus we would have unemployment 1 or 2 points higher.

Oh and should the banks have collapsed as well? Just curious.

SO now you are going to have to prove to me WHAT barriers he put UP, HOW he increased energy prices (that are controlled by OPEC)
an article about coal plants and joblessness, which I know is an issue but so is CLIMATE CHANGE. but that's a different thread.

I thought we have a rule about not flapping your gums without some kind of proof?

Most of what you state above, is mere conjecture by some right wing extremists.

So your response is to compare John McCain who isn't President and his non existent polices to Obama's. That is weaker than light beer. You have clearly lost this debate son.

Quote from: Just_the_facts_mamm on February 05, 2012, 05:54:12 PM
SO that would be one conservative guys opinion, now show me some evidence to that effect!
more flapping gums.

We could have been stuck with McCains plan?  He thought the economy was fine THE DAY BEFORE THE CRASH!

But GOP are on the ball, right??

Economists say that without the stimulus we would have unemployment 1 or 2 points higher.
Oh and should the banks have collapsed as well? Just curious.

Yes!!!
It is unconstitutional to use the treasury to bail out private entities.
Much in the same way Hussein stole billions from the people to fund a pipe dream called alternative energy, one that would never in a million years support out infrastructure.

QuoteSO now you are going to have to prove to me WHAT barriers he put UP, HOW he increased energy prices (that are controlled by OPEC)
an article about coal plants and joblessness, which I know is an issue but so is CLIMATE CHANGE. but that's a different thread.

I thought we have a rule about not flapping your gums without some kind of proof?

Most of what you state above, is mere conjecture by some right wing extremists.

Silly boy, even he himself said energy prices would necessarily sky rocket under his plan.
Do I need to post that proof as well, or have you conveniently forgotten how he also wanted to see $4.00 plus per gallon as a good start?

Quote from: Just_the_facts_mamm on February 05, 2012, 01:20:29 PM
well TAXED you are going to have to PROVE there was a coverup AND NOT with a conservative foil hat site!
sounds like Propaganda, looks like propaganda, It IS propaganda!
Smells like political vomit, looks like political vomit, It IS(you know the rest)
What do you base this on?


So Taxed has to " prove" it when you can babble about nonsense and imply Reagan admin "traded guns for drugs"...where is your proof of that?

Quote from: CHEVY VOLT GOVT on February 05, 2012, 08:28:42 PM

You have never heard of Iran contra??

Youngster?  google Iran contra.

Quote from: Just_the_facts_mamm on February 05, 2012, 08:35:48 PM
You have never heard of Iran contra??

Youngster?  google Iran contra.

Absolutely, I worked with a guy who was a pilot.....cite the proof of drugs in exchange for guns as you claim.

Billy

Quote from: Solar on February 05, 2012, 08:20:48 PM

Yes!!!
It is unconstitutional to use the treasury to bail out private entities.

you don't even know that the Bank bailout was signed by Bush!!

GOP did that there constitution stomping!  So blame the GOP for bailing out wall street NOT Obama!

He saved the economy with the stimulus though.

would you like to see where it went?

http://stimuluswatch.org/2.0/

You can look up thousands of stimulus projects, see how much, when it started, stopped. 

Very transparent, like Obama promised it would be.

and here you can read about the fantastic job creation.

http://newsjunkiepost.com/2010/10/08/its-official-more-private-sector-jobs-created-in-2010-than-during-entire-bush-years/

Quote from: Solar on February 05, 2012, 08:20:48 PM
Much in the same way Hussein stole billions from the people to fund a pipe dream called alternative energy, one that would never in a million years support out infrastructure.

The president can't steal money that congress has given him the power to do with, as he chooses.

The "steal" part would be a conservative adding his "opinion" to reality and pretending it's fact.

This is also a tired issue that we can debate semantics about for awhile but the fact remains that the Bush administration was trying to push it through before he left office, so you should drop it as an example of government evil.

(and yes I have already proved this to you several times, yet here you bring up Solyondra again.)

You also make it seem like NO ONE ever invested in alternative energy before and it was some RADICAL idea!

Many people way smarter than you and I think that is not the case.

Quote from: Solar on February 05, 2012, 08:20:48 PM
[/b]Silly boy, even he himself said energy prices would necessarily sky rocket under his plan.
Do I need to post that proof as well, or have you conveniently forgotten how he also wanted to see $4.00 plus per gallon as a good start?

I mean what is 'HIS PLAN"  like it's on a poster somewhere that we all memorize?

You should try explaining yourself and not assume that we live and breath Obama trivia!

what are you talking about?.

Tell me "HIS PLAN!"

If you have a speech where the pres says he want $4 gas then you will have to provide it, because to a rational person that sounds a bit DUMB for a president to tell the people!  Bush might have cause he was plain ignorant, but not Obama.

I will bet your above information you attribute to Obama, is out of context and that's why you offer no proof.

Conservatives never have proof. cause they make stuff up or vastly distort the truth hoping you don't look it up..