The Silence of American Hawks About Kiev’s Atrocities

Started by kalash, July 02, 2014, 07:18:54 AM

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kalash

http://www.thenation.com/article/180466/silence-american-hawks-about-kievs-atrocities#

"For weeks, the US-backed regime in Kiev has been committing atrocities against its own citizens in southeastern Ukraine, regions heavily populated by Russian-speaking Ukrainians and ethnic Russians. While victimizing a growing number of innocent people, including children, and degrading America's reputation, these military assaults on cities, captured on video, are generating pressure in Russia on President Vladimir Putin to "save our compatriots."

The reaction of the Obama administration—as well as the new cold-war hawks in Congress and in the establishment media—has been twofold: silence interrupted only by occasional statements excusing and thus encouraging more atrocities by Kiev. Very few Americans (notably, the independent scholar Gordon Hahn) have protested this shameful complicity. We may honorably disagree about the causes and resolution of the Ukrainian crisis, the worst US-Russian confrontation in decades, but not about deeds that are rising to the level of war crimes, if they have not already done so..."

suzziY

Yes it is an atrocity; meanwhile most Americans are focused on thousands of illegal immigrants pouring over our borders and being dumped onto our streets, as well as the VA, IRS, NSA, Obamacare Benghazi and the crisis that is consuming Iraq.  The media has not been able to silence those Obama failures/scandals.
"I believe in the United States of America as a government of the people, by the people, for the people; whose just powers are derived from the consent of the governed..."I therefore believe it is my duty to my country to love it, to support its Constitution..."

kit saginaw

The word 'atrocity' is too powerful.  It's associated with gassing and biochemical-warfare.  If those were happening, and if we had a normal politician as President, America would swoop-down on Kiev hard.  But right now, it's Putin's problem.  He hasn't been behaving like Счастливый "Любовь к трем апельсинам" , walking the countryside; a friend to all.

Walter Josh

Indeed it is Putin's problem and hardly ours.
Rome wanted an Empire and so created a military
to enforce its will. So did Britain, who built a Navy,
allowing it to go anywhere it chose, unopposed.
Our Founders warned us of Empires and entanglements.
But the likes of Woodrow Wilson and George Bush, who
wore their infantile humanitarian impulses on their sleeves,
insisted that we democratize the world. History has duly
recorded the consequences of their idiotic incompetence.
If a nation insists on being the world's policeman, it must
be led by hard and ruthless men of the caliber of Palmerston,
Von Bismarck, MacArthur etc. not buffoons like Wilson and Bush.
As Lord Acton astutely observed,"Good Men (well meaning
busybodies) are never Great."

kalash

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2677613/American-military-advisers-masterminding-Ukraines-surge-against-pro-Russian-separatists-bid-expand-Nato-east.html
A sign of where Ukrainian conflict could lead? Victims of mortar attack stand before their flaming home, like a scene from the Eastern Front in the Second World War


mdgiles

Quote from: Walter Josh on July 02, 2014, 01:33:42 PM
Indeed it is Putin's problem and hardly ours.
Rome wanted an Empire and so created a military
to enforce its will. So did Britain, who built a Navy,
allowing it to go anywhere it chose, unopposed.
Our Founders warned us of Empires and entanglements.
But the likes of Woodrow Wilson and George Bush, who
wore their infantile humanitarian impulses on their sleeves,
insisted that we democratize the world. History has duly
recorded the consequences of their idiotic incompetence.
If a nation insists on being the world's policeman, it must
be led by hard and ruthless men of the caliber of Palmerston,
Von Bismarck, MacArthur etc. not buffoons like Wilson and Bush.
As Lord Acton astutely observed,"Good Men (well meaning
busybodies) are never Great."
Bush conducted an experiment, we wanted to see if it was possible to remove the usual Middle Eastern dictatorship, and replace it with a democracy; thereby making them less of a future danger to us. The experiment failed, because the first thing they did in the democracy was return to the same old tribalism. Next time there is a terrorist attack - and there will be a next time - we go back to carpet bombing our enemies back to the Stone Age. Something that we've gotten away from since Korea.
"LIBERALS: their willful ignorance is rivaled only by their catastrophic stupidity"!

kalash

Opinion from Internet:
"Now America can keep its economy afloat only by working as "vacuum cleaner", that is causing global capitals to flee to  United States. But how to convince holders of the capitals to buy bonds of a stagnant economy? "

According to the expert, the U.S. wants to show the world that in the context of total horror, they are the only island of safety: "Hence the desire to tear Europe on Russian energy, impose sanctions, to burn all that is possible and what is not anywhere in the world. They want war, they want blood on TV, they want at any cost to show everyone around the world need to escape (with money) in the United States."

mdgiles

Quote from: kalash on July 03, 2014, 08:39:51 AM
Opinion from Internet:
"Now America can keep its economy afloat only by working as "vacuum cleaner", that is causing global capitals to flee to  United States. But how to convince holders of the capitals to buy bonds of a stagnant economy? "

According to the expert, the U.S. wants to show the world that in the context of total horror, they are the only island of safety: "Hence the desire to tear Europe on Russian energy, impose sanctions, to burn all that is possible and what is not anywhere in the world. They want war, they want blood on TV, they want at any cost to show everyone around the world need to escape (with money) in the United States."
The US has been the safe haven for capital, pretty much since the rest of the world decided to try this insane experiment with socialism. And we don't have to tear other countries to pieces, their leaders - like Putin - pretty much do that themselves. Oh yes, and the Europeans decided to get off Russian fossil fuels, when Putin decided to try and push them around.
"LIBERALS: their willful ignorance is rivaled only by their catastrophic stupidity"!

kalash

Quote from: mdgiles on July 03, 2014, 11:05:10 AM
when Putin decided to try and push them around.
How exactly and when this "pushing around" happen?

kalash

US to rev up regime change in Syria
http://blogs.rediff.com/mkbhadrakumar/2014/06/27/us-to-rev-up-regime-change-in-syria/
"...What is abundantly clear is that the US-Saudi 'regime change' agenda in Syria is back on centre stage. Clearly, Putin has a fight on his hands over Syria. But how can Putin possibly let go Ukraine, which is so vital for Russia's long term interests, by turning attention back to Syria? Obama senses that the time has come to take the regime change agenda in Syria to its logical conclusion. The audacity of Obama's hope is such that he hopes to win this chess game both in Syria and in Ukraine."

supsalemgr

Quote from: kalash on July 03, 2014, 02:34:01 PM
US to rev up regime change in Syria
http://blogs.rediff.com/mkbhadrakumar/2014/06/27/us-to-rev-up-regime-change-in-syria/
"...What is abundantly clear is that the US-Saudi 'regime change' agenda in Syria is back on centre stage. Clearly, Putin has a fight on his hands over Syria. But how can Putin possibly let go Ukraine, which is so vital for Russia's long term interests, by turning attention back to Syria? Obama senses that the time has come to take the regime change agenda in Syria to its logical conclusion. The audacity of Obama's hope is such that he hopes to win this chess game both in Syria and in Ukraine."

I think you give Obama too much credit. His only goals in Syria and Ukraine is not to allow them to further hurt his polls numbers.
"If you can't run with the big dawgs, stay on the porch!"

Solar

Quote from: supsalemgr on July 04, 2014, 04:06:44 AM
I think you give Obama too much credit. His only goals in Syria and Ukraine is not to allow them to further hurt his polls numbers.
65
I honestly believe his only goal, anywhere, is to make the US look as bad as possible.
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mdgiles

Quote from: kalash on July 03, 2014, 02:34:01 PM
US to rev up regime change in Syria
http://blogs.rediff.com/mkbhadrakumar/2014/06/27/us-to-rev-up-regime-change-in-syria/
"...What is abundantly clear is that the US-Saudi 'regime change' agenda in Syria is back on centre stage. Clearly, Putin has a fight on his hands over Syria. But how can Putin possibly let go Ukraine, which is so vital for Russia's long term interests, by turning attention back to Syria? Obama senses that the time has come to take the regime change agenda in Syria to its logical conclusion. The audacity of Obama's hope is such that he hopes to win this chess game both in Syria and in Ukraine."
That line alone raises the question of how disinterested you are over the situation in Ukraine. Ukraine is an independent state, it's none of Putin's business how the Ukrainians act in Ukraine. Unless of course, you believe he should use the existence of ethnic Russians within a neighboring state to interfere in that states affairs - which pretty much puts him on the same level as Hitler with the ethnic Germans in the Sudetenland.
"LIBERALS: their willful ignorance is rivaled only by their catastrophic stupidity"!

mdgiles

"LIBERALS: their willful ignorance is rivaled only by their catastrophic stupidity"!

kalash

Quote from: mdgiles on July 04, 2014, 06:15:06 AM
Unless of course, you believe he should use the existence of ethnic Russians within a neighboring state to interfere in that states affairs - which pretty much puts him on the same level as Hitler with the ethnic Germans in the Sudetenland.
Really? Hitler comparison? Why not compare it with USA? Or you think US never interfere in other states affairs to protect its citizens?