https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e1EmzSY-v-Y

Tucker Carlson comments (to me) sound like he doesn't understand the difference between "evil" and "necessary evil". I agree with Ben Shapiro. To me, it was a necessary evil. Japan "pearl harbor'ed" us/US. We dropped two of them, and they still wanted to continue. War is a necessary evil. You go to war to win. Do whatever it takes to stop our enemy. Nowadays, we have lost that edge. Back then, and now as well, we drop leaflets to warn. None of our enemies would ever do that for us.

Truth is, it was vengeance, there were many at the time who had proof Japan was about to surrender, regardless of what the Emperor wanted; Those highest in military knew they had already lost the war and were ready to surrender.
No doubt countless lives on our side were saved, but was the cost of innocent lives really necessary?
I'm not saying it was wrong, just pointing out it probably wasn't necessary.
Remember, the victor always writes the history books.

Quote from: Solar on May 06, 2024, 12:31:17 PMTruth is, it was vengeance, there were many at the time who had proof Japan was about to surrender, regardless of what the Emperor wanted; Those highest in military knew they had already lost the war and were ready to surrender.
No doubt countless lives on our side were saved, but was the cost of innocent lives really necessary?
I'm not saying it was wrong, just pointing out it probably wasn't necessary.
Remember, the victor always writes the history books.

There are a few other factors here.
The emperor wanted to surrender, but several years earlier, the military brass seized all power and made the emperor a figurehead. Even after the two bombs, some of the military brass still wanted to keep fighting.
Countless innocent lives on both sides were saved by ending the war.  The two bombs took far fewer lives than continuing the war would have.
Japan had already offered to surrender, but with these conditions -
1. They keep their government intact
2. They control the war crimes trials
If we had accepted those terms, Japan would still have had ambitions of conquest.
Japan had a warrior culture.  They considered surrender to be the ultimate dishonor.  (That's why Japan treated POWs so badly.  They thought that anyone who surrenders DESERVES humiliation!)  It took a new, terrifying weapon to make surrender socially acceptable to the Japanese people.
Japan was very cruel to the people they had conquered in Korea and Manchuria.  They expected to receive similar treatment if they surrendered.  The fact that America was not cruel after the war made them tremendously grateful.
We also wanted to show the Soviet Union what we had, and what it could do.  That is one major reason that Stalin did not invade Western Europe after the war.
Sometimes, doing really harsh things really is necessary.

Quote from: je_freedom on May 06, 2024, 03:03:46 PMThere are a few other factors here.
The emperor wanted to surrender, but several years earlier, the military brass seized all power and made the emperor a figurehead. Even after the two bombs, some of the military brass still wanted to keep fighting.
Countless innocent lives on both sides were saved by ending the war.  The two bombs took far fewer lives than continuing the war would have.
Japan had already offered to surrender, but with these conditions -
1. They keep their government intact
2. They control the war crimes trials
If we had accepted those terms, Japan would still have had ambitions of conquest.
Japan had a warrior culture.  They considered surrender to be the ultimate dishonor.  (That's why Japan treated POWs so badly.  They thought that anyone who surrenders DESERVES humiliation!)  It took a new, terrifying weapon to make surrender socially acceptable to the Japanese people.
Japan was very cruel to the people they had conquered in Korea and Manchuria.  They expected to receive similar treatment if they surrendered.  The fact that America was not cruel after the war made them tremendously grateful.
We also wanted to show the Soviet Union what we had, and what it could do.  That is one major reason that Stalin did not invade Western Europe after the war.
Sometimes, doing really harsh things really is necessary.

I have never heard anyone from that generation say we should not have dropped it. They wanted the war to end. When people have this conversation, I hope they remember how many millions died later due to communism.

Quote from: je_freedom on May 06, 2024, 03:03:46 PMThere are a few other factors here.
The emperor wanted to surrender, but several years earlier, the military brass seized all power and made the emperor a figurehead. Even after the two bombs, some of the military brass still wanted to keep fighting.
Countless innocent lives on both sides were saved by ending the war.  The two bombs took far fewer lives than continuing the war would have.
Japan had already offered to surrender, but with these conditions -
1. They keep their government intact
2. They control the war crimes trials
If we had accepted those terms, Japan would still have had ambitions of conquest.
Japan had a warrior culture.  They considered surrender to be the ultimate dishonor.  (That's why Japan treated POWs so badly.  They thought that anyone who surrenders DESERVES humiliation!)  It took a new, terrifying weapon to make surrender socially acceptable to the Japanese people.
Japan was very cruel to the people they had conquered in Korea and Manchuria.  They expected to receive similar treatment if they surrendered.  The fact that America was not cruel after the war made them tremendously grateful.
We also wanted to show the Soviet Union what we had, and what it could do.  That is one major reason that Stalin did not invade Western Europe after the war.
Sometimes, doing really harsh things really is necessary.

Yes, there are a lot of opinions on the issue, not real tangible facts, but had we simply kept hammering them, the end was an inevitability.
FDR had a tool he thought would reign in the rest of the world, he was a warmonger and proved it by using it, just like the left and RINO of today, they don't care either.

War is failed politics, don't forget that. We have 5 running wars as we speak, and still haven't learned from history because we're threatening Russia with a repeat?

Even the Japanese have moved on, the younger generation doesn't blame us, they blame their failed leadership.
Right or wrong, it's a history that should never be repeated.