Re-training workers for jobs. It is one of the things both O and Mitt have said they want to do. I am not enthusiastic about government training of anyone. They s*ck at teaching kids, why would they be any better/efficient at training workers? Shouldn't the businesses who will be hiring people pay to have them trained, even if they have to hire a foreign contract worker temporarily to train people.
I also think that part of the employment problem with college grads is that they are getting degrees that are not useful, and they are taught that they will get a cushy job with a free car right out of the gate.
Thoughts?
Quote from: JustKari on October 20, 2012, 09:03:33 AM
Re-training workers for jobs. It is one of the things both O and Mitt have said they want to do. I am not enthusiastic about government training of anyone. They s*ck at teaching kids, why would they be any better/efficient at training workers? Shouldn't the businesses who will be hiring people pay to have them trained, even if they have to hire a foreign contract worker temporarily to train people.
I also think that part of the employment problem with college grads is that they are getting degrees that are not useful, and they are taught that they will get a cushy job with a free car right out of the gate.
Thoughts?
You're right. Private entities should, and will do this better if government gets out of the way. Government interference merely muddles the picture, and trains people for the wrong professions in its all knowing way.
This can be seen clearly by the fact that there are many jobs available, with few takers, because few hold the skills to fill them.
I agree. But I like the idea of having the option of learning trades or vocations in high school. The left calls this a sellout, and that all kids should be prepared for college.
My answer to the idiot left? Our country is being run into the ground by people with ivy league educations. Where's all the smarts that came with those diplomas?
MORONS :cursing:
Quote from: kramarat on October 20, 2012, 10:47:57 AM
I agree. But I like the idea of having the option of learning trades or vocations in high school. The left calls this a sellout, and that all kids should be prepared for college.
My answer to the idiot left? Our country is being run into the ground by people with ivy league educations. Where's all the smarts that came with those diplomas?
MORONS :cursing:
When I was in school (boy I sound old), we had to learn woodworking, drafting, and either welding or soldering. We also had to learn sewing. I know they aren't complete trades, but I built the sewing business that I had with the knowledge I learned at the sewing machine in highschool.
Quote from: kramarat on October 20, 2012, 10:47:57 AM
I agree. But I like the idea of having the option of learning trades or vocations in high school. The left calls this a sellout, and that all kids should be prepared for college.
My answer to the idiot left? Our country is being run into the ground by people with ivy league educations. Where's all the smarts that came with those diplomas?
MORONS :cursing:
BINGO!!!
One of the problems in education in this country is the idea that everyone wants to - or needs to - or has the ability - go to college. So K-12 education is geared toward college prep. This means that a lot of kids who could make a livings as the electricians, plumbers and carpenters this country needs, but is no longer producing are pushed into college prep, when they have no intention of moving on into higher ed. A lot of this is the doing of the higher ed industry which likes nothing better than producing a bunch on unemployable, disgruntled, leftist, "intellectuals". Some of it has to do with minority groups who believe it's an insult if you actually steer their children into something they'll be able to make a living at or like doing.Someone who would like to make a living with their hands, finds much of K-12 boring or uninteresting, so they end up on a street corner somewhere.
Quote from: JustKari on October 20, 2012, 11:12:16 AM
When I was in school (boy I sound old), we had to learn woodworking, drafting, and either welding or soldering. We also had to learn sewing. I know they aren't complete trades, but I built the sewing business that I had with the knowledge I learned at the sewing machine in highschool.
Same here Kari, we got to take metal shop, electronics, wood working, crafts, which I was appointed shop steward all three years in high school.
I was a lousy student in all my classes, all based on pure boredom, but some of my teachers saw my potential and moved to expand my natural abilities.
Now, most of those classes no longer exist in the Ca school system, all replaced by PC BS like cultural studies etc.
If I were in school today, I would be considered a lost cause and slipped through the cracks.
Quote from: JustKari on October 20, 2012, 11:12:16 AM
When I was in school (boy I sound old), we had to learn woodworking, drafting, and either welding or soldering. We also had to learn sewing. I know they aren't complete trades, but I built the sewing business that I had with the knowledge I learned at the sewing machine in highschool.
Yeah, we had those too, but I think Romney's talking about taking it a step further, and actually having kids ready to enter the workforce. I really enjoyed A-school in the Navy. No garbage courses...........it strictly prepared us for the job we would be doing on the ship. It was fun.
Quote from: kramarat on October 20, 2012, 11:32:06 AM
Yeah, we had those too, but I think Romney's talking about taking it a step further, and actually having kids ready to enter the workforce. I really enjoyed A-school in the Navy. No garbage courses...........it strictly prepared us for the job we would be doing on the ship. It was fun.
Same here.
Mine was electronics/communication, killing and survival.
All skills i found extremely useful in everyday life.
I have yet to use one skill in particular..... :rolleyes:
Quote from: Solar on October 20, 2012, 11:47:24 AM
Same here.
Mine was electronics/communication, killing and survival.
All skills i found extremely useful in everyday life.
I have yet to use one skill in particular..... :rolleyes:
I had a college course called "killing", but I am betting we learned different things. :laugh:
Quote from: JustKari on October 20, 2012, 11:52:27 AM
I had a college course called "killing", but I am betting we learned different things. :laugh:
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
Yeah, ours had nothing to do with kindness, quite the opposite in fact.
Quote from: Solar on October 20, 2012, 11:55:20 AM
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
Yeah, ours had nothing to do with kindness, quite the opposite in fact.
Mine didn't either, my minor was criminality/sociology. My focus was serial killers, so my class was on different types of murder and those that commit murder. Perfectly worthless to me now, but interesting when I thought I wanted to be a feeb or work for the BCA.
Quote from: JustKari on October 20, 2012, 09:03:33 AM
Re-training workers for jobs. It is one of the things both O and Mitt have said they want to do. I am not enthusiastic about government training of anyone. They s*ck at teaching kids, why would they be any better/efficient at training workers? Shouldn't the businesses who will be hiring people pay to have them trained, even if they have to hire a foreign contract worker temporarily to train people.
I also think that part of the employment problem with college grads is that they are getting degrees that are not useful, and they are taught that they will get a cushy job with a free car right out of the gate.
Thoughts?
I think Mitt is talking about providing financial assistance to those that need to be re-trained into viable industries. Not having the government conduct the actual training.
Some companies do offer training, but not many IMO. I suppose it depends on the industry.
I do think you are correct on the unrealistic expectations of recent college graduates.
Quote from: mdgiles on October 20, 2012, 11:30:41 AM
BINGO!!!
One of the problems in education in this country is the idea that everyone wants to - or needs to - or has the ability - go to college. So K-12 education is geared toward college prep. This means that a lot of kids who could make a livings as the electricians, plumbers and carpenters this country needs, but is no longer producing are pushed into college prep, when they have no intention of moving on into higher ed. A lot of this is the doing of the higher ed industry which likes nothing better than producing a bunch on unemployable, disgruntled, leftist, "intellectuals". Some of it has to do with minority groups who believe it's an insult if you actually steer their children into something they'll be able to make a living at or like doing.Someone who would like to make a living with their hands, finds much of K-12 boring or uninteresting, so they end up on a street corner somewhere.
One problem is that in today's world there are far too many kids that don't want jobs that require them to get sweaty or dirty.
I've done my share of electrical and plumbing work and it can get pretty bad when it comes to sweat and mud and dirt.
Wiring a house attic in mid-July really sucks. As does working in crawl spaces under some homes.
Quote from: rich_t on October 20, 2012, 04:25:43 PM
One problem is that in today's world there are far too many kids that don't want jobs that require them to get sweaty or dirty.
I've done my share of electrical and plumbing work and it can get pretty bad when it comes to sweat and mud and dirt.
Wiring a house attic in mid-July really sucks. As does working in crawl spaces under some homes.
If that were true, cable TV wouldn't be full of DIY shows and Home Depot and Lowes would be of interest only to contractors.
Quote from: mdgiles on October 20, 2012, 05:10:40 PM
If that were true, cable TV wouldn't be full of DIY shows and Home Depot and Lowes would be of interest only to contractors.
I think home owners like to get sweaty and dirty on the weekends, so they can appreciate their office/cubicle job on Monday.
I've been doing dirty, sweaty manual labor since I was 12. I'm 50 now, and still at it. It gets old, but I wouldn't trade places with anyone that has to wear a suit and stay inside all day...............not to mention, they don't know how to fix anything. I couldn't live with myself. :blink:
Quote from: mdgiles on October 20, 2012, 05:10:40 PM
If that were true, cable TV wouldn't be full of DIY shows and Home Depot and Lowes would be of interest only to contractors.
Uh huh... How many older teens and young adults do you see when you go to your local Home Depot or Lowes?
I don't see too many at mine.
Quote from: rich_t on October 20, 2012, 05:49:00 PM
Uh huh... How many older teens and young adults do you see when you go to your local Home Depot or Lowes?
I don't see too many at mine.
In Obama's economy, most of the people in Home Depot work part time and wear orange aprons. Getting help or checking out is never a problem.
Yep. During the week, there are more bored employees than customers. :sad:
Quote from: kramarat on October 20, 2012, 06:31:47 PM
In Obama's economy, most of the people in Home Depot work part time and wear orange aprons. Getting help or checking out is never a problem.
Yep. During the week, there are more bored employees than customers. :sad:
The one in my area has cut way back on employees, so much so, you couldn't get help if you were dying.
And much of their business has gone local to other smaller stores because Home Despot backed the Fag movement.
People in my area are staunch Conservatives.
Quote from: kramarat on October 20, 2012, 06:31:47 PM
In Obama's economy, most of the people in Home Depot work part time and wear orange aprons. Getting help or checking out is never a problem.
Yep. During the week, there are more bored employees than customers. :sad:
Hmm... I find if I go at 7:00 A.M. I get all the help I need. After 9:00 A.M. good luck.
Perhaps I'm just a hopeless optimist, but I believe that many of those young people now occupying street corners would benefit from being introduced to a skill. The best thing about working with your hands is being ale to easily go back and look at what you've accomplished. I worked as an accountant for thirty years and closing out a fiscal year was different from looking at the tile I laid or the lights I put in.
Quote from: rich_t on October 20, 2012, 04:25:43 PM
One problem is that in today's world there are far too many kids that don't want jobs that require them to get sweaty or dirty.
I've done my share of electrical and plumbing work and it can get pretty bad when it comes to sweat and mud and dirt.
Wiring a house attic in mid-July really sucks. As does working in crawl spaces under some homes.
And one of the reasons some kids wouldn't even consider vocational schools instead of expensive colleges is because college education has been overly hyped to the point where people believe they can't make it without a degree from some ivy league school. Instead of racking up tens of thousands in debt, going to vocational schools will give students the skills to join a paid apprenticeship which as far as I know usually includes the company picking up the tab for their school tuition.
Now should these vocational schools or the prospective students receive government funding / grants? Probably not, otherwise tuition will once again skyrocket like universities. Government should stay out of this IMO.
Quote from: rocca on October 21, 2012, 11:09:48 AM
And one of the reasons some kids wouldn't even consider vocational schools instead of expensive colleges is because college education has been overly hyped to the point where people believe they can't make it without a degree from some ivy league school. Instead of racking up tens of thousands in debt, going to vocational schools will give students the skills to join a paid apprenticeship which as far as I know usually includes the company picking up the tab for their school tuition.
Now should these vocational schools or the prospective students receive government funding / grants? Probably not, otherwise tuition will once again skyrocket like universities. Government should stay out of this IMO.
Absolutely Correct, and I agree 100%
Quote from: mdgiles on October 21, 2012, 09:17:57 AM
Perhaps I'm just a hopeless optimist, but I believe that many of those young people now occupying street corners would benefit from being introduced to a skill. The best thing about working with your hands is being ale to easily go back and look at what you've accomplished. I worked as an accountant for thirty years and closing out a fiscal year was different from looking at the tile I laid or the lights I put in.
Absolutely. It's hard to beat the gratification that comes with building or doing something, that has physical, tangible results. It would be a great to get kids more aquainted with these skills. We should also stop equating having loads of money, with success. I can't count the number of rich people that I've worked for, that are miserable.
Quote from: JustKari on October 20, 2012, 09:03:33 AM
Re-training workers for jobs. It is one of the things both O and Mitt have said they want to do. I am not enthusiastic about government training of anyone. They s*ck at teaching kids, why would they be any better/efficient at training workers? Shouldn't the businesses who will be hiring people pay to have them trained, even if they have to hire a foreign contract worker temporarily to train people.
I also think that part of the employment problem with college grads is that they are getting degrees that are not useful, and they are taught that they will get a cushy job with a free car right out of the gate.
Thoughts?
I think the government should get out of the student loan business and turn it back over to private lenders. Let the market work. Under the current arrangement, most any student, especially those with minority status, can borrow money to go to technical training. For some it is good, for most, it is a waste of time and money.