My father and I had a conversation about this about 2 weeks before the original post.

He stated that my generation, GenX were selfish, self absorbed, lazy people.

I asked him which generation instated most of these welfare programs used today?

Selfish and self absorbed is taking advantage of "entitlements" and passing the bill along to your children.

Selfish and self absorbed is selling out your countries manufacturing base and American jobs because you want a cheap electronics.

Are baby boomers to blame? You bet they are.

Maybe instead of the Boomers blaming GenX or the Millennials maybe they should ask themselves how they failed so miserably to pass along the traits they CLAIM to value.

To hear my father, a Boomer, a liberal leftist, a union member who voted for Barrack Obama twice criticize a whole generation when the Boomers set the bar so pathetically low was almost laughable.

That is my take on this whole subject.

Quote from: ZQuickSilverZ on June 03, 2016, 02:25:16 AM
My father and I had a conversation about this about 2 weeks before the original post.

He stated that my generation, GenX were selfish, self absorbed, lazy people.

I asked him which generation instated most of these welfare programs used today?

Selfish and self absorbed is taking advantage of "entitlements" and passing the bill along to your children.

Selfish and self absorbed is selling out your countries manufacturing base and American jobs because you want a cheap electronics.

Are baby boomers to blame? You bet they are.

Maybe instead of the Boomers blaming GenX or the Millennials maybe they should ask themselves how they failed so miserably to pass along the traits they CLAIM to value.

To hear my father, a Boomer, a liberal leftist, a union member who voted for Barrack Obama twice criticize a whole generation when the Boomers set the bar so pathetically low was almost laughable.

That is my take on this whole subject.

Interesting that he blames your gen, when it was his fathers gen that created the welfare state, his father that failed to pass along values that prohibited his gen from abusing the use of OPM.
But then, it was never designed to help anyone, it was always meant to enslave the populace.
How old are you Z?

39

Quote from: ZQuickSilverZ on June 03, 2016, 02:25:16 AM
To hear my father, a Boomer, a liberal leftist, a union member who voted for Barrack Obama twice criticize a whole generation when the Boomers set the bar so pathetically low was almost laughable.

Unions are like crystal meth.
They raise wages in the short term,
stimulating prosperity,
just like meth stimulates activity.

But then, companies move manufacturing overseas
to escape the high labor cost,
leaving the workers destitute,
just like meth leaves the user exhausted.

Unions distort the market.
A free market would provide long-lasting prosperity,
not a rush, and then a crash like we're seeing now.

Without unions, the USA would still be like in the '60s,
when jobs were plentiful.
Companies kept raising wages because they had to
to attract workers.

Quote from: je_freedom on June 03, 2016, 08:50:47 PM
Without unions, the USA would still be like in the '60s,
when jobs were plentiful.
Companies kept raising wages because they had to
to attract workers.

That's some nice fiction.

Now here are some facts.

If you adjust for inflation and market conditions, American labor is cheaper now for most companies than it has been in the last 30 years, UNION or not.

When you have illegal labor, temp services, insourcing (read H-1B), and offshoring all contributing to lost jobs and falling wages UNIONS should be at the very bottom of your list. I am NOT pro UNION by any means. I believe the only thing a UNION is good for is fostering a beneficial environment for the incompetent and lazy while punishing the intelligent and hard working, all while indoctrinating the membership with leftest agendas. I say that having belonged to one as a condition of employment for 12 years.

Where I live temp services supply revolving door employees to Bama. Want to bet the majority of those are illegal? I worked there a short time during layoff and the only chatter I heard in the break room was Spanish or Chinese. If the company gets caught they just blame the temp services.  If the temp service gets caught they just slap a new name on the door and it's business as usual. That is why I have made comments in the past (if not on here than on the other forum I frequent) about wishing they would BAN temp services. Those things are a plague.

You call them temp services, I call them insurance against facing the penalties for the use of illegal labor.

Let me ask you this, have you EVER seen a company significantly lower prices after offshoring a factory to reflect their lower cost of production?

Companies want to charge American prices and pay Chinese labor. Apple wants to sell stupid people a phone for $600 that probably cost them $50 to manufacture, package, and ship from China.

To say that UNIONs are driving this behavior because of wage demands and not exponentially increasing profit margins driven by American stupidity is pure fiction.

I believe in free market, but when stupidity is driving a 1200% percent markup it's time to get a little perspective.

Quote from: ZQuickSilverZ on June 04, 2016, 04:37:42 AM
That's some nice fiction.

Now here are some facts.

If you adjust for inflation and market conditions, American labor is cheaper now for most companies than it has been in the last 30 years, UNION or not.

When you have illegal labor, temp services, insourcing (read H-1B), and offshoring all contributing to lost jobs and falling wages UNIONS should be at the very bottom of your list. I am NOT pro UNION by any means. I believe the only thing a UNION is good for is fostering a beneficial environment for the incompetent and lazy while punishing the intelligent and hard working, all while indoctrinating the membership with leftest agendas. I say that having belonged to one as a condition of employment for 12 years.

Where I live temp services supply revolving door employees to Bama. Want to bet the majority of those are illegal? I worked there a short time during layoff and the only chatter I heard in the break room was Spanish or Chinese. If the company gets caught they just blame the temp services.  If the temp service gets caught they just slap a new name on the door and it's business as usual. That is why I have made comments in the past (if not on here than on the other forum I frequent) about wishing they would BAN temp services. Those things are a plague.

You call them temp services, I call them insurance against facing the penalties for the use of illegal labor.

Let me ask you this, have you EVER seen a company significantly lower prices after offshoring a factory to reflect their lower cost of production?

Companies want to charge American prices and pay Chinese labor. Apple wants to sell stupid people a phone for $600 that probably cost them $50 to manufacture, package, and ship from China.

To say that UNIONs are driving this behavior because of wage demands and not exponentially increasing profit margins driven by American stupidity is pure fiction.

I believe in free market, but when stupidity is driving a 1200% percent markup it's time to get a little perspective.

Yet you neglect to see the Fed/Union symbiosis of Keynes backed failed policy effect on the free mkt.
Unlike corporate America of the 70s, both party's made it not only possible to expand business interests around the globe, they made it profitable to fire American workers, as well as bail on America proper.
There is no single boogie man in this equation, it took bad regulation on business to drive industry to look for a solution, govt to screw with regulation making leaving the country to be more attractive to business, and leaving the American consumer with no other option but to buy imports against their own interests.

Throw in an open border and refusal to enforce the law, add to that Commiecare, where keeping full time workers is a burden to industry, and you have the makings of a soon to be failed third failed economy.
The real culprit here is Marxism infecting the nation, and not for any other reason than to destroy it's core values, which it's succeeding at an amazing rate.

Quote from: Solar on June 04, 2016, 06:38:47 AM
Yet you neglect to see the Fed/Union symbiosis of Keynes backed failed policy effect on the free mkt.

Economist John Maynard Keynes ("Keens")
made himself popular among government officeholders
by saying that the best way to run an economy
is to take all decision making power away from entrepreneurs
and give it to government officeholders.

That worked out great for the government officeholders,
but terrible for consumers,
who got taken out of the equation.

Quote from: je_freedom on June 04, 2016, 07:31:03 AM
Economist John Maynard Keynes ("Keens")
made himself popular among government officeholders
by saying that the best way to run an economy
is to take all decision making power away from entrepreneurs
and give it to government officeholders.

That worked out great for the government officeholders,
but terrible for consumers,
who got taken out of the equation.

Which is why our nation is in the mess it's in, Marxist ideals being applied to free mkt concepts.
Communism and free mkt capitalism simply can't coexist....

Quote from: Solar on June 04, 2016, 06:38:47 AM
Unlike corporate America of the 70s, both party's made it not only possible to expand business interests around the globe, they made it profitable to fire American workers, as well as bail on America proper.

Throw in an open border and refusal to enforce the law, add to that Commiecare, where keeping full time workers is a burden to industry, and you have the makings of a soon to be failed third failed economy.

Isn't that what I said?

I neglected nothing. However, to state they are offshoring work due to UNION demands is pure fantasy. They are offshoring because doing so allows them to use make American profit at Chinese cost. Let's call it what it is.

Quote from: ZQuickSilverZ on June 04, 2016, 04:37:42 AM
Let me ask you this, have you EVER seen a company significantly lower prices after offshoring a factory to reflect their lower cost of production?

Companies want to charge American prices and pay Chinese labor. Apple wants to sell stupid people a phone for $600 that probably cost them $50 to manufacture, package, and ship from China.

To say that UNIONs are driving this behavior because of wage demands and not exponentially increasing profit margins driven by American stupidity is pure fiction.

There are several factors contributing to the disparity of cost
between U.S. and foreign production.  Union wages are one factor.

If you look at your local department store,
you'll see foreign brands replacing U.S. brands,
on many products, such as air conditioners, microwave ovens, etc.
And the foreign brands do sell for less $$ than the U.S. brands they replace.

Other contributing factors include tax rates.
U.S. production has to pay all kinds of taxes,
while most foreign countries rebate all taxes
to the companies that make products that get exported.

Fair Tax would level that disparity.

Quote from: ZQuickSilverZ on June 04, 2016, 03:31:04 PM
Isn't that what I said?

No.

QuoteI neglected nothing.

Yeah, you completely left out Marxist degradation and it's purpose of destroying American culture at every turn.
Everything else is cause and effect after the fact.

QuoteHowever, to state they are offshoring work due to UNION demands is pure fantasy.

Do you not make the connection between Unions and the communist movement? Personally I don't care, and I do agree, that in the big scheme of things, they, like so many other tools in the communist box are merely just that, a tool.

QuoteThey are offshoring because doing so allows them to use make American profit at Chinese cost. Let's call it what it is.

Yeah, I said that.

Quote from: Solar on June 04, 2016, 06:47:47 PMNo.

I disagree.

Quote from: Solar on June 04, 2016, 06:47:47 PMDo you not make the connection between Unions and the communist movement?

I do yes.

Quote from: ZQuickSilverZ on June 04, 2016, 04:37:42 AMI believe the only thing a UNION is good for is fostering a beneficial environment for the incompetent and lazy while punishing the intelligent and hard working, all while indoctrinating the membership with leftest agendas. I say that having belonged to one as a condition of employment for 12 years.

Well, the title is a bit of a loaded question, so is, "What RALLY is the purpose of a Union?"

I have really *mixed* feelings about Unions and Boomers, QuickSilver and I agree on the fostering laziness.   What ever good purpose they had, it's long over, or taken over by slugs & commie thugs.

There's something about that FDR picture - the cigarette in the mouth, faking a happy days look... I always found disturbing.
                         

I don't see a POTUS, I can imagine him being a Union Elitist Thug, "America works for ME, or they don't work at all...!"

I also agree with Solar, it was The Greatest Generation that started us down the road of Socialism.

What I cannot figure out ... why would they deliberately try to kill off the entrepreneurial spirit?  Isn't that the ultimate American Dream, start your own business and make your way in the world?  Your hard work, and unique ideas can give birth to a thriving company?   Where did we go wrong?  When did we go wrong?




Fixed jpg.
walks

Quote from: Hoofer on June 05, 2016, 01:39:25 PM
Well, the title is a bit of a loaded question, so is, "What RALLY is the purpose of a Union?"

I have really *mixed* feelings about Unions and Boomers, QuickSilver and I agree on the fostering laziness.   What ever good purpose they had, it's long over, or taken over by slugs & commie thugs.

There's something about that FDR picture - the cigarette in the mouth, faking a happy days look... I always found disturbing.

Note the similarities? Oh, no...Not the image, but the attributes shared by the characters, greed, ego power?


                         

Quote
I don't see a POTUS, I can imagine him being a Union Elitist Thug, "America works for ME, or they don't work at all...!"

I also agree with Solar, it was The Greatest Generation that started us down the road of Socialism.

What I cannot figure out ... why would they deliberately try to kill off the entrepreneurial spirit?  Isn't that the ultimate American Dream, start your own business and make your way in the world?  Your hard work, and unique ideas can give birth to a thriving company?   Where did we go wrong?  When did we go wrong?

Sadly, the leftists have always been about jealousy of other people' achievements, trying to destroy the relationship between employee and business.
Divide and conquer is as old as prostitution, and leftists have perfected it into a political movement where they are only happy when there is an adversarial relationship.
Hell, look at race relations in the last 7 years, just one more tool in a commies bag of tricks of unrest.

Bottom line is the topic of the thread is "Are Boomers the political problem".

My answer to that is yes. Yes they are.

The "greatest generation"  may have taken the first steps but, the Boomers are the ones who went off the cliff.

That is my opinion.

Generation X (my generation) has done nothing to fix the problem and the millennials..... they are the worst of all. They feel entitled to that which they have not earned and put more value on their cell phone than they do their fellow man.

The fact millennials support that socialist pig "free stuff" Bernie Sanders should tell you all you need to know about them.