NATO vs. Yugoslavia 1999

Started by milos, July 19, 2015, 01:37:17 AM

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milos

I wanted to share some of my personal experience and thoughts as a civilian being bombed for 78 days. This will not be a rage against NATO, because I don't hate NATO, I am actually proud I had such a great enemy against me. I was 21 at that time.

I remember that evening, March 24th 1999, it was around 8:10 PM when I heard on TV news that NATO has started its military campaign against my country. We have gathered in the living room of our apartment on the second floor in the center of Belgrade, the capital of Yugoslavia and Serbia, sitting around the table, and waiting what will happen. I expected bombs falling everywhere around. But I only heard some distant detonations, and that was all. So, I was a bit disappointed, I was like: "What, that was that? I am going to sleep." Some of the days later, people from our building were gathering in the basement. It was like a party, people bringing foods and drinks, and I have truly met some of them for the first time. Then, a neighbor came, and said: "You are all going to die in that basement if a bomb falls, upper floors are more secure." And so our partying was over.

I have spent most of those 78 days in my home city of Belgrade, and some on the countryside with my grandparents. Some of my countrymen fled to Hungary, or countries they had relatives in, but there was no real reasons to flee, because the bombing outside Kosovo was not that much severe. We had blackouts in the beginning, but due to increased number of traffic accidents, the authorities decided to turn street lights on again. I was in a life danger only once, when the national TV station was bombed on April 23th, at 2:06 AM. We lived some 300 meters away. I remember that night. I woke up in my bed seconds before the attack. I heard the aircraft flying. Than the missile fired. And it was a "boom" like an earthquake, the building heavily shaken, and the window glasses almost broke. I assumed: "It must have been the television." So I turned on my TV, and there was no program on the national television. I searched other channels, and saw live broadcast from the television building, with broken walls, and dead people hanging.

In the video below, you may see a live footage of bombing of the military headquarters in Belgrade.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTllSoTRyco

Since the schools weren't working, and most of the companies too, it was like a permanent party outside. There were protests held every day. When we shot down the F-117A stealth fighter on March 27th, someone wrote a slogan: "Sorry, we didn't know it was invisible.", and it became a motto of the resistance, it even appeared on postcards. I have actually encountered with those young men who wrote it first, they were standing near the main city square, drinking beer, and bragging about someone stolen their slogan, like their copyright was broken.



The villagers gathered around the shot down F-117A.



One of the postcards.

The most annoying thing here in Belgrade during the bombing were air raid sirens. They were interesting to listen to in the beginning, but very soon after I became like: "Oh, no, the sirens again, shut down those bastards!" It felt like sirens were waging their war against me, and not NATO. People were massively complaining against the sirens, so the authorities eventually decided to silence them most of the time. And then, it was like, I walk the street, then a "boom", and the ground shakes a bit, and a couple of minutes later, the sirens for warning. But it was better that way.

Here is the original sound recording of the sirens from that time. You would freak out if you had to listen to this shit like four times a day every day. I was thinking like "Drop dead!" to them every time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n58kUN-TJJY

I have heard some rumors at that time that President Milošević had actually agreed with NATO to capitulate in advance. The story went like this. Milošević knew NATO will overturn him. If he just surrendered with no fight, then he will be treated like a coward. So, he made an agreement with NATO, and it went like this: "You bomb us for couple of days. Then, I say NATO is too powerful compared to us, so we have to surrender. I look as a hero, and you get Kosovo." I was angry to hear this, thinking those people were traitors. But now, I realize they were right. Milošević really made such agreement with NATO. The only thing that was not going according to their plan were the people. Our people surprised both Milošević and NATO with the will to fight. So the war kept prolonging. At the end, Milošević eventually decided to surrender as it had been planned. He called general Nebojša Pavković, who was the commander of our Third Army at that time, and the chief commander of our forces defending Kosovo. Milošević asked Pavković to sign a peace treaty with NATO in the town of Kumanovo. Pavković was surprised to hear this demand. He refused to sign a peace treaty with NATO, saying: "It is not what I have been doing. We can win this war." Milošević replied: "But NATO is much stronger than we are." Pavković asked: "Then, why have we started the resistance at the first place?", but Milošević remained with no answer. Nobody who was under general Pavković's command wanted to sign the treaty either, so, Milošević was forced to bribe some other general to sign it. Our military was so disappointed this happened, they couldn't believe their eyes and ears.

Here is a TV footage of general Nebojša Pavković at his war position in Kosovo from April 17th 1999. In the video, he says: "NATO has just destroyed our military infrastructure so far. In the zone of the Third Army, our forces have shot down 16 NATO aircraft, 5 helicopters, 4 drones, and 46 cruise missiles. There are 150,000 of armed men in Kosovo at the moment, who are ready to fight until their final victory."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpsoOzNohpc

In 2009, Nebojša Pavković was convicted by the International Criminal Tribunal for the former Yugoslavia (ICTY) of committing crimes against humanity and war crimes in the Kosovo War, and sentenced to 22 years in prison. He is probably the most innocent man convicted in the Hague Tribunal, only for the guilt of successfully defending his country. When I was in one year of compulsory military service from March 2000-2001, general Nebojša Pavković was the Chief of the General Staff, so I am proud to say he was my commander, and I was his soldier.

My thought is that NATO could have never won this war. The war was a great bluff from their side. To win the war, they had to find NATO supporters in my country on the first place, and there were none at that time. With no NATO supporters, every house would be enemy, and it would be a very difficult situation for NATO. Maybe they could have killed 7 million people, but, the question is what the international public would say on that, NATO would definitely look as a mass murderer. And this is European country, not some Africa or Asia. If they wanted to capture only Kosovo, I believe it would be impossible, because even if they did so, they would still be faced with constant attacks, so they would have to conquer the whole country. We had 150,000 army and police forces in Kosovo, NATO had 50,000 troops on the borders in Albania and Macedonia. Maybe NATO was better armed and equipped, but the number of armed men and the terrain were on our side. This is no desert, there are plenty of positions to take cover. During those 78 days of bombing, our forces had suffered only minor losses, few percent of troops and vehicles. We have figured out that it takes 6 hours from the time NATO spy satellites record the position of our units, to the time NATO planes arrive. So, our units were changing their positions for every 6 hours, sometimes leaving false targets behind them. So, most of the time, when NATO planes arrived, they could not locate their targets, or were destroying false targets. NATO was pushing Albanian soldiers to try to break the border, but with no success, thousands of Albanian soldiers were killed in these attempts. The most heavy attacks were at the spot called Košare, where Albanian soldiers were attacking constantly for all 78 days each day and night. If NATO decided to engage their own troops on the border, it would have become a hell on Earth for both sides. When I served the army, some officers told me we had 2 million rifles to give to the people, and enough ammunition, oil, and food, to sustain 2 or 3 years of war.
One Christ. One Body of Christ. One Eucharist. One Church.

Solar

The war Americans were kept ignorant about, one of the first times the Leftists showed their hand, that they were willing to support the enemy of Christianity and use the full might of the US Military to do it.
As an American, I apologize, but had the country been awake and informed, they wouldn't have ever allowed it.

All anyone knew at the time was there were slaughter in genocide, and that's all the media told people, that it was race based, not that Muscum had started this war long before, that the people of the land were sick of Muscums and wanted them gone at any price, noooo, all we were told was that a certain group of thugs were the oppressors, and that the peaceful Muscums needed protecting.

Yeah, Americans were lied to, and since it was only NATO support, for their air campaign, we were't really involved anyway.
Yes, our govt lied to us with the help of Marxist media.
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supsalemgr

Quote from: Solar on July 19, 2015, 06:33:20 AM
The war Americans were kept ignorant about, one of the first times the Leftists showed their hand, that they were willing to support the enemy of Christianity and use the full might of the US Military to do it.
As an American, I apologize, but had the country been awake and informed, they wouldn't have ever allowed it.

All anyone knew at the time was there were slaughter in genocide, and that's all the media told people, that it was race based, not that Muscum had started this war long before, that the people of the land were sick of Muscums and wanted them gone at any price, noooo, all we were told was that a certain group of thugs were the oppressors, and that the peaceful Muscums needed protecting.

Yeah, Americans were lied to, and since it was only NATO support, for their air campaign, we were't really involved anyway.
Yes, our govt lied to us with the help of Marxist media.

Being prior to 2001 most Americans, me included, did not fully understand the threat of radical Islam. Quite frankly, we did not pay much attention to what was going in the Balkans. That is our fault.
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Solar

Quote from: supsalemgr on July 19, 2015, 08:32:00 AM
Being prior to 2001 most Americans, me included, did not fully understand the threat of radical Islam. Quite frankly, we did not pay much attention to what was going in the Balkans. That is our fault.
All by design, which is why Klinton got away with using NATO against our allies while leftist media spun stories and ran block for him.
Much has changed in the last decade, in that the majority of the nation recognize both party's are guilty in more ways than one can imagine.
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milos

Quote from: Solar on July 19, 2015, 06:33:20 AM
The war Americans were kept ignorant about, one of the first times the Leftists showed their hand, that they were willing to support the enemy of Christianity and use the full might of the US Military to do it.
As an American, I apologize, but had the country been awake and informed, they wouldn't have ever allowed it.

All anyone knew at the time was there were slaughter in genocide, and that's all the media told people, that it was race based, not that Muscum had started this war long before, that the people of the land were sick of Muscums and wanted them gone at any price, noooo, all we were told was that a certain group of thugs were the oppressors, and that the peaceful Muscums needed protecting.

Yeah, Americans were lied to, and since it was only NATO support, for their air campaign, we were't really involved anyway.
Yes, our govt lied to us with the help of Marxist media.

Thank you. But you don't need to apologize, I am aware you are not guilty. I blame Tony Blair, Bill Clinton, and their administrations. NATO attack on Yugoslavia in 1999 was even against NATO's own policy, because Yugoslavia didn't attack any NATO country. We even didn't attack Albania, but Albania attacked us alongside with NATO during the 1999 war.

After WWII, Albanians were massively emigrating from Albania into Serbia, because they had better life in Serbia than in Albania. Any Albanian can only confirm this as a true fact. And their "thank you" was to start a rebellion against us. If they wanted to recognize Serbia as their country, they could have had normal lives. But no, they had that bad trip about independent Kosovo, instead. Many Albanians live everywhere across Serbia, they usually keep bakeries, and outside Kosovo, where Serbs form the majority, Albanians have never had any problems. I have an Albanian bakery here in the neighborhood, too. I often come to buy their products, I eat that bread which was made by the Albanian hands, and I can only say it is delicious. That is how much we hate the Albanians, that we trust them to eat the food made by their own hands. They have made problems only in Kosovo, where they had formed the majority after WWII.

I am aware that people across the world don't really care for the Balkans, because they have no personal interest in this region. But NATO obviously has some precious interests, since it cares for this region that much.
One Christ. One Body of Christ. One Eucharist. One Church.