heating suggestions

Started by JustKari, September 02, 2012, 07:29:27 PM

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kramarat

Kari. If you end up heating with wood, I use craigslist to get mine. Look under free stuff. The tree guys will dump it in your yard. Otherwise, I'll take my truck and go get it, but it's usually already cut up.

tbone0106

Quote from: Solar on September 03, 2012, 10:07:16 AM
Good point...
I too went with Metalbest, or what at the time was Metalbestos, all stainless steel.
There is no better pipes on the mkt, costly, but well worth it.

Note to Kari, go with an all straight pipe, no elbows, the elbow is where 99% of all wood stove fires start, though, with the pipe Kramarat suggested, that probability is low.
What happens, is oils, soot and unburned gases solidify and become trapped in the turn, and eventually catch fire, making the elbow extra hot.
A straight pipe run is far easier to keep clean, usually some really hot dry wood and a cranked up stove once a week will keep the chimney clean, and I mean spotless.
So think about the shortest straight run to the outside, that will be the safest place.
Then there is the issue with a long run of pipe, the cost is very high, but requires constant cleaning, because the upper most of the stack never gets hot and the particles cling to the inside walls, to the point of choking off exhaust flow.
Shorter the run the better.

I'm sure I don't need to tell you to get bids for the job, even if you do it yourself, the experts will point out stuff you may have never considered.
It may even be cheaper if they do it, considering they get the pipes cheaper than you could.

Excellent advice. Shorter and straighter runs are ALWAYS better -- but not always available or practical.

I have a situation where my chimney is an exterior stack of chimney blocks, and a cast masonry block gives me a horizontal access to the flue. Thus, my setup is a short run vertically from the stove (maybe 2 1/2 feet), then practically horizontal to the wall (maybe 4 ft.), then straight up. I scrub my chimney flue every year. There is a cleanout that helps with that. And I completely replace all my chimney pipe ever two years. Painted carbon steel flue pipe -- that is, regular black inside wood stove flue pipe -- is thin and flimsy, and rusts in the off-season. (Here we call that "summer."  :tounge:)

My local Tractor Supply store has flue-cleaning products you can use through the heating season. They're slender plastic tubes loaded with chemicals that help detach the creosote and other deposits from the chimney walls. They're cheap and they work, and I recommend them highly. I don't have a brand name handy, but get with the folks at your local TSC and they'll fix you up. If you don't have a local TSC, the sticks can be had on the net. Let me know, and I'll help you find them.

Solar

Quote from: tbone0106 on September 03, 2012, 01:44:03 PM
Excellent advice. Shorter and straighter runs are ALWAYS better -- but not always available or practical.

I have a situation where my chimney is an exterior stack of chimney blocks, and a cast masonry block gives me a horizontal access to the flue. Thus, my setup is a short run vertically from the stove (maybe 2 1/2 feet), then practically horizontal to the wall (maybe 4 ft.), then straight up. I scrub my chimney flue every year. There is a cleanout that helps with that. And I completely replace all my chimney pipe ever two years. Painted carbon steel flue pipe -- that is, regular black inside wood stove flue pipe -- is thin and flimsy, and rusts in the off-season. (Here we call that "summer."  :tounge:)

My local Tractor Supply store has flue-cleaning products you can use through the heating season. They're slender plastic tubes loaded with chemicals that help detach the creosote and other deposits from the chimney walls. They're cheap and they work, and I recommend them highly. I don't have a brand name handy, but get with the folks at your local TSC and they'll fix you up. If you don't have a local TSC, the sticks can be had on the net. Let me know, and I'll help you find them.
I used those before, and you're right, they really do clean well.
I too had a steel short piece on my stove till I bought another section of metalbestos to replace it.
But in the interim it had rusted/burned through causing a 4' section of the good pipe to come crashing down and crush it leaving one black mess to clean up.
That was the third and final time I would replace it, I sprung for the good stuff after that.

There is a hardware store in town that has the wood stove at one end of the store and runs horizontally 25' of the blue steel pipe about 8' off the ground, they did it to capture as much heat as possible.
Looks strange, but I'll be damned if it isn't efficient and warms the entire store quite well, that and ceiling fans to circulate it.

They have two of these on top of the stove and they really throw the air out when the stove is cranking.
Runs off the heat of the stove, I know you've seen them, but if you're like me, you're too cheap to buy them too. :laugh:
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tbone0106

Simplest, and maybe best, wood stove heat exchanger I've ever seen was made of two six-inch tees, four six-inch elbows, and six short sections of six-inch pipe. I have raked the internet looking for a picture of the arrangement, to no avail. To describe it: straight pipe up from the stove to the first tee, then sideways via short sections both ways to the first elbows, then upwards via short sections on both sides to the second pair of elbows, then back together via short sections to the second tee, then up and out. It is basically an O-shaped flue stack with an inlet at the bottom and an outlet at the top.

It was a  common arrangement in earlier times, when ceiling heights were typically higher than they are today. I've seen it in more than one western movie. Despite the number of times I've measured, I can't quite make it work in my situation.

Solar

Oh yeah, I've seen that before, even thought of trying it, but that was when I was broke and it was either miss a meal, or work on the house.
I chose to eat. :laugh:
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JustKari

So the other half and I went to Menards this weekend (we have a Northern Tool, but it is almost an hour away, so we'll wait to check that out closer to purchase time).  It is going to cost a lot more than we thought to have the electrical run and turned back on than we budgeted for, so wood stove it is.  We will price out the competition and see what installation will cost, not sure if it is a DIY thing or not.  Depends on dh's comfort level with it.  He does plan on registering here and checking this thread though, because it is a wealth of information.  Thanks for all the help in making this decision!

kramarat

Quote from: JustKari on September 07, 2012, 11:39:47 AM
So the other half and I went to Menards this weekend (we have a Northern Tool, but it is almost an hour away, so we'll wait to check that out closer to purchase time).  It is going to cost a lot more than we thought to have the electrical run and turned back on than we budgeted for, so wood stove it is.  We will price out the competition and see what installation will cost, not sure if it is a DIY thing or not.  Depends on dh's comfort level with it.  He does plan on registering here and checking this thread though, because it is a wealth of information.  Thanks for all the help in making this decision!

I got this one. Money is always an object for me. This thing cranks, it's fairly inexpensive, and they delivered it to the house on a flatbed truck.

http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200446396_200446396

JustKari

Quote from: kramarat on September 07, 2012, 11:49:06 AM
I got this one. Money is always an object for me. This thing cranks, it's fairly inexpensive, and they delivered it to the house on a flatbed truck.

http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200446396_200446396

That is really similar to the one dh and I both liked, except the max log size was only 20", I am guessing that there is a huge benefit to being able to use larger logs.  Like having to put live in less often and jack.g to split less.

kramarat

Quote from: JustKari on September 07, 2012, 12:45:54 PM
That is really similar to the one dh and I both liked, except the max log size was only 20", I am guessing that there is a huge benefit to being able to use larger logs.  Like having to put live in less often and jack.g to split less.

Yeah, less cutting. Plus I can load it up at night when it's in the 20's, close down the damper, and it's still in the high 60's in the house, when I wake up in the morning.

tbone0106

That's the basic Vogelzang boxwood stove, which they made in two sizes. I have the larger one which, despite the specs, will actually take a log up to 30" long, if you can wiggle it through the door.

These are inexpensive stoves, but very good at the same time. Understand that they're NOT airtight, you WON'T be getting any firebrick with your purchase, and -- worst of all, in my book -- the stove does not ship with a grate. You WILL want a grate. You can get one most of the time at Tractor Supply or QFF for around 30 bucks. In my experience, the cast iron grate lasts about one season.

JustKari

Quote from: tbone0106 on September 07, 2012, 01:43:16 PM
That's the basic Vogelzang boxwood stove, which they made in two sizes. I have the larger one which, despite the specs, will actually take a log up to 30" long, if you can wiggle it through the door.

These are inexpensive stoves, but very good at the same time. Understand that they're NOT airtight, you WON'T be getting any firebrick with your purchase, and -- worst of all, in my book -- the stove does not ship with a grate. You WILL want a grate. You can get one most of the time at Tractor Supply or QFF for around 30 bucks. In my experience, the cast iron grate lasts about one season.

That is good to know, it's all those unexpected extras that make it hard to do a cost analysis.  It was the Volgelzang model we saw, but obviously the smaller one, and the price was more, so obviously we won't be getting it from Menards.  We also need to put in heat protective flooring, and on the wall behind it.  All these things add up.

kramarat

#26
Quote from: tbone0106 on September 07, 2012, 01:43:16 PM
That's the basic Vogelzang boxwood stove, which they made in two sizes. I have the larger one which, despite the specs, will actually take a log up to 30" long, if you can wiggle it through the door.

These are inexpensive stoves, but very good at the same time. Understand that they're NOT airtight, you WON'T be getting any firebrick with your purchase, and -- worst of all, in my book -- the stove does not ship with a grate. You WILL want a grate. You can get one most of the time at Tractor Supply or QFF for around 30 bucks. In my experience, the cast iron grate lasts about one season.

I don't use a grate. No firebrick either. It's basically a cast iron box with a door and a damper.

I load it up with fairly large, split oak, and use a small piece of one of the starters in the link, to get it going. In the morning, I use a poker to push the hot embers to one side of the stove, shovel out the ash, push the glowing embers back in a pile in the center, stack wood on top of them....................and I'm back off to the races.

Forgot the link.
http://www.pinemountainbrands.com/pages/firestarters/26.php

Solar

Quote from: JustKari on September 07, 2012, 01:49:38 PM
That is good to know, it's all those unexpected extras that make it hard to do a cost analysis.  It was the Volgelzang model we saw, but obviously the smaller one, and the price was more, so obviously we won't be getting it from Menards.  We also need to put in heat protective flooring, and on the wall behind it.  All these things add up.
Kari, look at craigslist under free, or run your own ad, a lot of people upgrade this time of year and give away really nice stoves.
My brother contacted a stove store and ask them to call when someone upgraded, he got a super nice rolled steel stove for $100., and it was only a year old.
Cast iron is OK, but they tend to leak a lot, especially as they age, and you can never quick fire one, it causes them to crack.
But if you're really on a tight budget, it's a quick fix till something better comes along.
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kramarat

Quote from: Solar on September 07, 2012, 02:19:59 PM
Kari, look at craigslist under free, or run your own ad, a lot of people upgrade this time of year and give away really nice stoves.
My brother contacted a stove store and ask them to call when someone upgraded, he got a super nice rolled steel stove for $100., and it was only a year old.
Cast iron is OK, but they tend to leak a lot, especially as they age, and you can never quick fire one, it causes them to crack.
But if you're really on a tight budget, it's a quick fix till something better comes along.

Yeah. I don't buy anything without checking craigslist.

Heating with wood isn't a huge deal, but it does take time to perfect everything................from getting the wood, to how to start the fire, to how to burn the fire most efficiently and not blowing too hot, or smoking out out all your neighbors. None of it is hard, but there's a little science to it.

I try to get all my wood together for the following winter, in the spring, while it's still nice out. Got lazy a couple of years, and was out getting wood in June, in temperatures in the 90s. Not fun.

walkstall

My BIL made me a woodstove out of 7/16 rolled steel.  24"W X 42"L
X 26"H with double hung doors with a 32" opening.   I always used a grate and firebricks.  You could cook a 4 course meal on it.  You must be replacing your unit off and on.   I used it for over 45 years.  When we moved I put it in my boy's house as we could not use it where we live now.  We would have to leave the doors and windows open if we fired it off.   :lol:
 
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