Quote from: AndyJackson on August 06, 2013, 12:10:57 PM
haha, you actually grabbed and actually did claim the "I make more than 1000.00 per hour as a consultant" thing.  lol, that's sad.

People in this stratosphere end up on syndicated radio / TV, or in the White House.....like, um, Mark Levin  !

Not chumps who are desperately trying to get people to believe how smart and omniscient they are, on the internet.

Stratosphere? You actually think that people like Levin are some sort of sanctified idols? 

The problem with people like yourself is that you spend so much time drooling down your chest, that when you actually find someone who's not, you imagine they must be a fraud because they're not idolized in some sort of "stratosphere" that you recognize.  No, actually the problem is actually those like yourself with a perpetual snail trail down the center of their shirt.

I don't give a damn what people think about me, or my intelligence. What I hope for is that there are people who are reading this exchange and recognizing the points I am making. I'm not here to impress you, nor even influence you, as you're quite clearly a lost cause and ignoramus, which is why I've identified you as the poster child for the failings of the Republican Party.

Quote from: AndyJackson on August 06, 2013, 12:10:57 PM
And yes, I have made this about you.  I'm not the one claiming to be an expert, you are.  And it's clear that you have nothing to base it on.  Other than...uh, I know some lawyers and my daddy was one and I read a lot.  This is sad, too.

You've made this about me, in a desperate flailing defense of Romney, since your first post in this Constitution forum, because that's all you've got! You don't have any grasp of the Constitution at all, and you don't have any desire to acquire such! You've only got your investment in your partisan hackery, a slick-n-slide t-shirt for your oysters,  and the label "conservative" you've dishonestly stuck to your own dumb ass.

I've not claimed to be an "expert"; I've repeatedly referenced the Founders themselves, they're the experts!   But you, you've only referenced your own dumbass, unfounded opinion! 

You call me a know-it-all, but by your own actions you're a know-nothing, because you provide nothing to source your arguments at all! In fact you've got no argument whatsoever, hence the fact you have to entirely address me on a  personal basis, the last resort of Internet blowhards.

Quote from: AndyJackson on August 06, 2013, 12:10:57 PM
You seem to know more than me on the topic, and that's fine.  You should have something to show for your lifetime of frantic internet research, and I'm glad it's that.

But I still have enough common sense, and life experience, to believe that I'm right WRT the states' rights issue.

So, um, deal with it.  Or pitch some more fits, lol.  Just keep it less than 2500 words, please.  People are falling asleep.

Any elementary school child that paid attention in class and actually considered what the Constitution indicates knows more than you!    Any foreigner that studied and took the citizen test knows more than you, from recognizing that the DOI talks about "unalienable rights", and that this actually means the states have no authority to alienate those rights!  It's a very simple, fundamental concept!

So far you have not exhibited even any benefit from that claimed common sense and life experience. And you're quite incapable of "dealing with"  the fact of your own ignorance, given your ongoing personalized rants.   You don't even have the good sense to recognize at this point that I'm the last person on here you want to engage a personalized attack, because I will, and am, showing you to be the resident partisan tool.

Take a bow, as you are in fact the poster child of what is wrong with the Republican Party.   Go hug Mitt, or some other icon, maybe you'll  feel better.

Man, I wish a had a fiver for every little juvenile insult in that post  !!  Good stuff.

Hey, I'll resign from this never-ending struggle to save the world from lack of internet research.

People are puking and having seizures at this point, reading this shit.

Have yourself a time; I shall interfere no more.

"Stratosphere" is a term that's been used forever for the highly successful.  As in, make it to the top of US politics (for the good guys), get to the top of media / entertainment (for the good guys), etc.

No, it's not just something to be bitter about, from the anger of one's dark, dank den & keyboard.

Trip wrote something important on page 2.  "State power" more than "state right."

The founders and framers usually referred to the control one has over his life as rights, and the control that government has as power.  For some reason, the Tenth reads a little different.

I think once one rephrases it to "state power" to secede, the question about whether it exists answers itself.  G. Washington pointed out that "Government is force and nothing more."  Yes, force, power.  That's what government is.

Secession is an act of government and thus an act of force.  The issue turns on whether the government that secedes has the power to make it hold up.  That is, the seceding part has to win the war, if the sovereign decides not to let go.   

Quote from: Obama666 on September 24, 2013, 04:05:23 PM
Trip wrote something important on page 2.  "State power" more than "state right."

The founders and framers usually referred to the control one has over his life as rights, and the control that government has as power.  For some reason, the Tenth reads a little different.

I think once one rephrases it to "state power" to secede, the question about whether it exists answers itself.  G. Washington pointed out that "Government is force and nothing more."  Yes, force, power.  That's what government is.

Secession is an act of government and thus an act of force.  The issue turns on whether the government that secedes has the power to make it hold up.  That is, the seceding part has to win the war, if the sovereign decides not to let go.

Lincolns war against the South was illegal and unconstitutional Lincoln himself knew it too.

But watch out here's know it all trip to tell us all differently.

Quote from: daidalos on September 26, 2013, 12:30:49 AM
Lincolns war against the South was illegal and unconstitutional Lincoln himself knew it too.

But watch out here's know it all trip to tell us all differently.

Trips long gone, I told him to come back after the mid terms and eat his words.

Quote from: daidalos on September 26, 2013, 12:30:49 AM
Lincolns war against the South was illegal and unconstitutional Lincoln himself knew it too.

Interesting response that ignores all the points.  I wonder how the war against "the south" was any more illegal than the one "the south" had been conducting against the US for months before Lincoln was inaugurated. 

I am not really interested in what "states" do but I totally believe in the legitimacy of individual secession.

I will be working to acquire my live birth record, establish a common law trust and formally renounce all association with the state, and its social security number.

Quote from: TowardLiberty on October 07, 2013, 07:05:45 AM
I am not really interested in what "states" do but I totally believe in the legitimacy of individual secession.

I will be working to acquire my live birth record, establish a common law trust and formally renounce all association with the state, and its social security number.

I'll assume that includes a refusal to pay taxes a well?
I say that because the IRS obviously cares not for your personal resistance, so much so, that they'll use you as an example to others that defy them.
I've seen it countless times, arrests, prison terms and no one to help them.

Good luck, I sincerely hope you secede, or rather succeed.

Quote from: Solar on October 07, 2013, 07:51:59 AM
I'll assume that includes a refusal to pay taxes a well?
I say that because the IRS obviously cares not for your personal resistance, so much so, that they'll use you as an example to others that defy them.
I've seen it countless times, arrests, prison terms and no one to help them.

Good luck, I sincerely hope you secede, or rather succeed.

Yes, that includes being non-taxable.

When you quit the corporation (United States) you no longer have to play by their rules. You give up the benefits and privileges and get back your natural liberty.

Quote from: Obama666 on October 01, 2013, 08:55:19 PM
Interesting response that ignores all the points.  I wonder how the war against "the south" was any more illegal than the one "the south" had been conducting against the US for months before Lincoln was inaugurated.

The Confederacy didn't invade northern states. No no that one was done by Union (northern states) troops. Under Orders of the tyrant President Linclon. I'm sorry if it offends some of your liberal education indoctrination. It was a hard pill for me to swallow as well. But if you research Lincoln, read his own memoirs/diary/journal, and then compare it with what our Constitution really states, you can only come to one conclusion. Lincoln was a tyrant. Please note the period.

Quote from: TowardLiberty on October 08, 2013, 06:46:30 AM
Yes, that includes being non-taxable.

When you quit the corporation (United States) you no longer have to play by their rules. You give up the benefits and privileges and get back your natural liberty.

Want to bet? See Ruby Ridge, Waco Texas.....and what our current tyrannical Federal government does to those who refuse to play by it's rules.

Quote from: Solar on October 07, 2013, 07:51:59 AM
I'll assume that includes a refusal to pay taxes a well?
I say that because the IRS obviously cares not for your personal resistance, so much so, that they'll use you as an example to others that defy them.
I've seen it countless times, arrests, prison terms and no one to help them.

Hey, you can stick a letter stating your intentions to the IRS's door with a dagger if you want to.   But that's a little more extreme than what most people are doing right now.

"Refusal" is a relative term.  Everyone who pays taxes has always cheated to some extent.  That extent is changing drastically.  And with Obamacare, that's going to multiply - rapidly.

Ayn Rand was wrong.  Atlas is shrugging right now, but that's not taking the form of a handful of geniuses moving to an invisible canyon somewhere.  It's taking the form of millions of American wealth-creators belatedly figuring out that the federal government considers them its enemy.

Liberals have been staging agitprop protests for half a century now - with massive media coverage - and people barely noticed.  But this is only the second time in American history that TAXPAYERS are revolting.  No matter what the news tells you, that's actually going to be a really big deal.

Quote from: daidalos on October 10, 2013, 01:35:45 AM
The Confederacy didn't invade northern states. No no that one was done by Union (northern states) troops. Under Orders of the tyrant President Linclon. I'm sorry if it offends some of your liberal education indoctrination. It was a hard pill for me to swallow as well. But if you research Lincoln, read his own memoirs/diary/journal, and then compare it with what our Constitution really states, you can only come to one conclusion. Lincoln was a tyrant. Please note the period.

He was a tyrant because he did not have the constitutional right to wage war on a domestic enemy? I never understood the arguments against Lincoln, the whole issue of state rights seems invalid when those states break individual rights.

Quote from: daidalos on October 10, 2013, 01:38:30 AM
Want to bet? See Ruby Ridge, Waco Texas.....and what our current tyrannical Federal government does to those who refuse to play by it's rules.

Yes, individuals will never get anywhere except stomped by various agency thugs.

The only hope is in large scale administrative/legal actions, like nullification, constitutional convention, legit lawsuits, gutting the IRS with legislation while we have an opening with today's IRS issues..............

The sovereign citizens and all that crap is just silly folks with idle foolishness.  They may have a principled stand.....but it's worthless in reality.