The problems of drugs changes the equation of running faster and throwing harder and faster, jumping higher, even hitting a ball harder and farther.I assume you are referring to base ball specifically here?The problem is the dishonor it does to those before them in the quest to be the very best at what they do.Drugs in this case(imo), are simply cheating, but if they are here to stay, lets have an asterisk next to the record that had fallen, denoting that an enhancing drug had been used.Point is, why not just use a motorcycle to round the bases, after all, it was the player driving the bike...I used to own a chain of health clubs bearing my name, I had a hard and fast rule about drugs, if it didn't come from food, it doesn't belong in my club.If someone was using steroids in my club, they were shown the door.The damage it does to the body is amazing, it really does some serious premature aging.Maybe we need two leagues, one that uses drugs and the other that touts ones natural abilities?Then again, neither would appeal to me, seeing how sportsmanship is a lost and dying art...
On this I disagree with you Solar. The quest to "be the best that they can be" would include everything that is at hand. You said that if it doesn't come in food it doesn't belong on your club. Are we going back to the stone age? No aspirin for a headache? No Tylenol for aches and pains? No salves and ointments for cuts and bruises.
Do you think the War on Drugs is a good idea - despite it chipping away at our Constitutional rights and putting more and more power into the hands of the police. Oh wait, they're doing it for our good.
My point is this; we use drugs constantly in our society. In all manner of shapes and varieties. About the same time that we stepped out of the trees, we stopped relying on our natural abilities. How did a weakling, with no fangs, no claws and fairly slow, get to the top of the food chain? Drugs are simply further along a continuum that starts with stone hand axes. They are simply another tool. Should training methods revert to earlier eras? Diets? Equipment?
Sportsmanship is an idea invented by "gentlemen" to differentiate themselves from those "vulgar" types. The American ideal has always been winning. And athletes have always been out there looking for that "edge".
And my point about the sportscasters was that their hatred for steroids is irrational in light of how their regular lives operate. IOW, don't preach to me on the "evils" of marijuana - and then go out a kill half a bottle of bourbon. They're just different drugs and it all boils down to preference. One other thing sportscasters, like the rest of the media, are at heart, leftists. I don't think they really "like" most of the millionaires that they cover.
Last thing, as for the player driving the motorcycle around the bases, that would be against the rules. But there is nothing inherently "wrong" with it (besides the fact that the bike won't fit in the batters box among other problems), it's just one of the arbitrary choices being made. As for that asterisk thing, are we going to put one before all records set before Jackie Robinson entered the big leagues? How about one for all pitching records before they lowered the mound? Fielding records before the era of large gloves?
They are sold over the counter aren't they?
Society sets the rules, if you are stupid enough to get caught in public breaking the law that society deems important, then you will suffer the consequences, e.g drunk driving comes to mind.But based on the way you are approaching this, I assume you want those laws lifted as well, seeing how they dictate ones life as being intrusive?
Yes, exercise is still part of the regime isn't it?
Sad, Sportsmanship used to be an American ideal. Do disagree with the meaning of sportsmanship?"Fairness in following the rules of the game"
Irrelevant, I could care less what an armchair quarterback thinks.
Last time i looked, Robinson was human, or are you making a point I'm not getting?As to the rest, if they have a historical impact on statistics, then yes, there should be an asterisk.
Let me ask you, if you were competing for a job, only one available, and everyone had to take a test, but the rule was, no calculators were allowed, but the guy that got the job cheated and used a calculator.How would you view the issue?Remember, Sports also has a rule about steroids...
So were steroids originally. You should check into the Drug laws and exactly why some drugs are banned. It often has nothing to do with their supposed good or bad effects. But other less savory sociological reasons. So all the rules that society sets make sense or are fair? Sometimes these rules aren't base on anything more than preference. Haven't we seen enough of the Left making rules "for our own good"? In any case yes, I want them lifted. I see no profit in spending society's time and money rescuing people from the rewards of their own stupidity. Banning drunk driving is not intrusive, as it resides in the area of privilege - which driving is; but lighting up in the privacy of my living room or using steroids in my gym? Why are we spending time and money trying Barry Bonds, doesn't the Federal government have enough bank robbers, terrorists and serial killers to run down?I believe you missed my point. You should remember that at one point steroids were NOT banned. And why are they seen as anything other than another tool? What is the difference between a new and more advanced piece of training equipment and drugs? Simply another way to get from point A to point B. Would that be anything like whatever it was Gaylord Perry used to put on the baseball. Or George Brett putting pine tar all the way up the barrel of the bat? Some tennis player going ballistic at the line judge? A golfer taking a mulligan? Or are those just some of the none sportsmanlike things we "wink" at.Uh, not when it was one of my main points in the first place.Point is, if you're going to make a big deal out of steroids, why should we show the same respect for records set when large portions of the population weren't even allowed to compete. Eras change. The people playing the games change. My point is that it makes no more sense to ban steroid users that it does to throw out records from other eras.If I were the boss I want to give the job to the sneaky SOB who managed to sneak the calculator in, and use it, without being caught. I never assumed life was fair. If I were the guy competingfor the job, why wouldn't I rat him out?
I guess you and I will have to agree to disagree, for a society to function, there needs to be rules.
You see no problem screwing the other guy, if it means getting ahead, I get that from this statement:
I personally like having rules, it gives me something with which to work within, a boundary, something that we all agree upon, that makes the playing field fair.
Take our social contract of obeying a simple red light, or stop sign, or even the fact that we drive on the right side of the street.These are rules as a society we all agree upon, but using your logic, its OK to break them if it benefits you?We all need boundaries in life, it is these boundaries that we all measure our efforts against.
Conservatives have always been about rules and structure, it is the lib that constantly wants to move the boundary line.
Whats next, murder will be just another lifestyle?
Do you get my point? We all need guidelines to work within, so as to measure success .But keep moving the goal post, and eventually the whole thing becomes meaningless.
Yes, but these rules need to make sense and to not have been arbitrarily imposed. Also society has to have decided upon these rules. Look at Prohibition, something the was foisted upon the nation by a loud minority for "our own good". By the time it was done, there were more drinkers in the US, than before it had began. And organized crime had grown into a national menace.No, simple recognition that "nice guys finish last", and sometimes it's better to screw him before he gets the chance to screw you.That's assuming that WE did ALL agreed upon them and they weren't something arbitrarily imposed. Which is the point I raised with PED. This is a society steeped in drugs. As I noted from something to get you up in the morning to something to help you get to sleep at night. So why did we arbitrarily ban them in this instance? The reasons given make no since in light of other instances of not so fair play.But rules of the road are safety rules. Made in an effort to make driving safe for all of us. To go back to your motorcycle on the base paths, what catcher would want try covering the plate if the "runner" was coming in atop a powered vehicle? BTW, it should be understood that simply because I'm against SOME rules at SOME times, it does not follow that I am against ALL rules at ALL times. Because I think some rules are silly that doesn't naturally lead to the conclusion that I'm an anarchist.Conservatives have never been about rules simply for rules sake. It's our leftist friends who want absolute control of every endeavor.In what why does allowing murder - or even taking a neutral position on it - enhance public safety? In what way does use of steroids harm public safety? If it doesn't harm the public, why are we making laws against it?Sure - if you can explain why a particular substance - which once wasn't banned - was. You speak of moving the goal posts, so how is changing the rules on PED's less than moving the goal posts. Especially in light of other "goal post moves"; like lowering the mound, changes to the strike zone, or changes in equipment and training methods or making the season longer or shorter. Explain to me why using a drug is any different than any of those other changes - unless of course you simply don't "like" drugs. On that case you, simply would like to legislate a personal preference, and that isn't conservative.
Did these players not sign a contract stating they would abide by the rules set forth?If they break the rules, should they not be punished by the league?
As to lowering the mound, or changing the strike zone, I honestly don't remember why it was done, but did it effect the fans, did their children suddenly feel compelled to do something destructive to their bodies?Point is, kids and people in general emulate these players, (God only knows why), but its a reality of life, so when these guys take the short cut to developing strength, kids see no problem with taking the easy path as well.
So what happens when bionics enters the equation, robotic arms and legs, given the pace of advancement in computers and prosthetics, will these players be allowed to compete?
Sports is a reflection of society, so why hold the rule breakers in a special place in the record books?
It really comes down to a question of morality.
Again you miss the point, I never asked that they be let off Scot free, I only noted that the rules are stupid. And serve no rational reason.Uh, oh. We're into the "role model" excuse. To quite Charles Barkley on the subject of athletes as role models :"Just because I can dunk a basketball, doesn't mean I should raise your kids". Role models should be parents, and others close to the family. Not strangers on some far off playing field.Why not? Will these enhancements be available to all players?Because the rules make no sense, like the rules that used to keep blacks out of major sports. Do you think those rules made sense? How did they reflect on society, except badly.No, it comes down to a question of your personal beliefs. I see no more wrong with using PED's than I do with taking the handful of pills every morning that are - hopefully - keeping me alive. Much as I'd like to "caveman" it, and remove all these artificial life extenders from my existence, I've grown fond of the living, breathing thing.
We're not born to be 300 pounds or jump 30 feet.
I think it should be up to the governing body of the sport or league, but I think use of steroids should be banned.First off, it hurts the game. Yes, you want to be bigger, stronger, and faster, but there is more to the game (basketball, football, whatever) than brute force. You still need to shoot a ball. You still need to read a defense. You still need to be able to cut off an angle of an advancing player. You still need to run your route. A lot of players are lazy and don't want to practice as hard, or do fall victim to the "I need to do this because the other guy is juicing and will outperform me" trap.
Secondly, it is destructive to the body over time.
If a kid has a dream to get into a pro league, and practices and plays and finally does it, he shouldn't be penalized to never achieve greatness because he didn't shoot up.
People evolve over time, yes, but that is the natural part of the game.
Pitchers, for example, take steroids because of the recovery time. It isn't right that a pitcher who has practiced and plays his whole life, and with all things being equal, would be one of the greats, because he has to let his arm heal for a few days while the juicer is ready the next night, he loses out.
Sports should be about your skill and putting the results of your dedication against the next guy's, along with any natural advantage you have.
If you have ever believed and preached practice to a kid, then you really can't be OK with juicing. Otherwise, you have to tell the kid "practice real hard and when you get to college, juice up so you have a shot at the pros".
I am pulling out my hair enough with the pussification of sports, like the NFL and NBA, that we really don't need to compound it with steroids. A player who knows the rules and chooses to disobey is a bad person morally, and should really be never heard from again once they are caught.