Quote from: Dan on September 27, 2010, 02:12:34 PM
OK Crepe05, would you help us out and explain to us where you differ on the issues from Conservatives. From an issues standpoint, what makes you a RINO?

Until we all get a better handle on that one, it's hard to see how we can have a serious conversation.

Geeze, silly little ole me. I thought I was being quite serious.

I differ big time on the conservatives opinion and lack of use for the republicans who are more moderate than they.  I believe I made that very clear.  That's actually the big complaint that I have against conservatives, true or not.  Also I hate that term "true conservative".  It reeks of snobbishness and closed mindedness.

I want our party to be open to all citizens.  I view conservatives as wanting to close the party to those who don't agree with them.  I believe in the conservative political values.  I don't believe in their treatment of those who don't believe as they do.  That's when I get angry.  Again I'll say that it's real anger, not "having a bad day anger".  I think that conservatives need to get as many people as possible in their party, and as the people mature and grow older they become more conservative themselves.  I was more liberal in my twenties and then I grew up.  Not wanting moderates in the party is just insane from my viewpoint

It's not the party's issues, it's their pomposity as I see it..

Quote from: crepe05 on September 27, 2010, 02:55:30 PM

Quote from: Dan on September 27, 2010, 02:12:34 PM
OK Crepe05, would you help us out and explain to us where you differ on the issues from Conservatives. From an issues standpoint, what makes you a RINO?

Until we all get a better handle on that one, it's hard to see how we can have a serious conversation.

Geeze, silly little ole me. I thought I was being quite serious.

I differ big time on the conservatives opinion and lack of use for the republicans who are more moderate than they.  I believe I made that very clear.  That's actually the big complaint that I have against conservatives, true or not.  Also I hate that term "true conservative".  It reeks of snobbishness and closed mindedness.

I want our party to be open to all citizens.  I view conservatives as wanting to close the party to those who don't agree with them.  I believe in the conservative political values.  I don't believe in their treatment of those who don't believe as they do.  That's when I get angry.  Again I'll say that it's real anger, not "having a bad day anger".  I think that conservatives need to get as many people as possible in their party, and as the people mature and grow older they become more conservative themselves.  I was more liberal in my twenties and then I grew up.  Not wanting moderates in the party is just insane from my viewpoint

It's not the party's issues, it's their pomposity as I see it..

crepe were asking for an actual example, not a vague description.

Let me give you an example of a RINO.
Republican, Joseph Cao, he was the only Pub to vote in favor of obama care.

Do you think he belongs in the Party?

Quote from: Solar on September 27, 2010, 03:00:46 PM

Quote from: crepe05 on September 27, 2010, 02:55:30 PM

Quote from: Dan on September 27, 2010, 02:12:34 PM
OK Crepe05, would you help us out and explain to us where you differ on the issues from Conservatives. From an issues standpoint, what makes you a RINO?

Until we all get a better handle on that one, it's hard to see how we can have a serious conversation.

Geeze, silly little ole me. I thought I was being quite serious.

I differ big time on the conservatives opinion and lack of use for the republicans who are more moderate than they.  I believe I made that very clear.  That's actually the big complaint that I have against conservatives, true or not.  Also I hate that term "true conservative".  It reeks of snobbishness and closed mindedness.

I want our party to be open to all citizens.  I view conservatives as wanting to close the party to those who don't agree with them.  I believe in the conservative political values.  I don't believe in their treatment of those who don't believe as they do.  That's when I get angry.  Again I'll say that it's real anger, not "having a bad day anger".  I think that conservatives need to get as many people as possible in their party, and as the people mature and grow older they become more conservative themselves.  I was more liberal in my twenties and then I grew up.  Not wanting moderates in the party is just insane from my viewpoint

It's not the party's issues, it's their pomposity as I see it..

crepe were asking for an actual example, not a vague description.

Let me give you an example of a RINO.
Republican, Joseph Cao, he was the only Pub to vote in favor of obama care.

Do you think he belongs in the Party?

I'm not Miss Crepe, but I will simply ask you this, Solar. Presuming he doesn't belong in the Party, HOW DO YOU REMOVE HIM?

Quote from: Shooterman on September 27, 2010, 03:23:51 PM

Quote from: Solar on September 27, 2010, 03:00:46 PM

Quote from: crepe05 on September 27, 2010, 02:55:30 PM

Quote from: Dan on September 27, 2010, 02:12:34 PM
OK Crepe05, would you help us out and explain to us where you differ on the issues from Conservatives. From an issues standpoint, what makes you a RINO?

Until we all get a better handle on that one, it's hard to see how we can have a serious conversation.

Geeze, silly little ole me. I thought I was being quite serious.

I differ big time on the conservatives opinion and lack of use for the republicans who are more moderate than they.  I believe I made that very clear.  That's actually the big complaint that I have against conservatives, true or not.  Also I hate that term "true conservative".  It reeks of snobbishness and closed mindedness.

I want our party to be open to all citizens.  I view conservatives as wanting to close the party to those who don't agree with them.  I believe in the conservative political values.  I don't believe in their treatment of those who don't believe as they do.  That's when I get angry.  Again I'll say that it's real anger, not "having a bad day anger".  I think that conservatives need to get as many people as possible in their party, and as the people mature and grow older they become more conservative themselves.  I was more liberal in my twenties and then I grew up.  Not wanting moderates in the party is just insane from my viewpoint

It's not the party's issues, it's their pomposity as I see it..

crepe were asking for an actual example, not a vague description.

Let me give you an example of a RINO.
Republican, Joseph Cao, he was the only Pub to vote in favor of obama care.

Do you think he belongs in the Party?

I'm not Miss Crepe, but I will simply ask you this, Solar. Presuming he doesn't belong in the Party, HOW DO YOU REMOVE HIM?

By supporting his opponent monetarily.
Recall, or even impeachment, depending on the offense.
Any other questions?

Quote from: Shooterman on September 27, 2010, 10:46:01 AM
C'mon, guys. Y'all need to lighten up on this business. I've read enough of Miss Crepe's stuff to not think this is an impostor. Hell, for all I know, we're all impostors here. Sheeesh. Quit drinking the DIM Kool Aid.

I certainly don't always agree with Miss Crepe, and to a large extent, believe she is wrong in this, but the simple fact remains, unless anyone here has access to voting in every election in the US, you can only try to control your own Representative and Senator. You may send money to those you particularly wish to endorse, but other than that, a circle jerk will do you better. YOU CAN NOT CONTROL HOW PEOPLE VOTE ELSEWHERE!

Naw, there's only one Old Curmudgeon. ;)

Quote from: Solar on September 27, 2010, 03:28:19 PM

Quote from: Shooterman on September 27, 2010, 03:23:51 PM

Quote from: Solar on September 27, 2010, 03:00:46 PM

Quote from: crepe05 on September 27, 2010, 02:55:30 PM

Quote from: Dan on September 27, 2010, 02:12:34 PM
OK Crepe05, would you help us out and explain to us where you differ on the issues from Conservatives. From an issues standpoint, what makes you a RINO?

Until we all get a better handle on that one, it's hard to see how we can have a serious conversation.

Geeze, silly little ole me. I thought I was being quite serious.

I differ big time on the conservatives opinion and lack of use for the republicans who are more moderate than they.  I believe I made that very clear.  That's actually the big complaint that I have against conservatives, true or not.  Also I hate that term "true conservative".  It reeks of snobbishness and closed mindedness.

I want our party to be open to all citizens.  I view conservatives as wanting to close the party to those who don't agree with them.  I believe in the conservative political values.  I don't believe in their treatment of those who don't believe as they do.  That's when I get angry.  Again I'll say that it's real anger, not "having a bad day anger".  I think that conservatives need to get as many people as possible in their party, and as the people mature and grow older they become more conservative themselves.  I was more liberal in my twenties and then I grew up.  Not wanting moderates in the party is just insane from my viewpoint

It's not the party's issues, it's their pomposity as I see it..

crepe were asking for an actual example, not a vague description.

Let me give you an example of a RINO.
Republican, Joseph Cao, he was the only Pub to vote in favor of obama care.

Do you think he belongs in the Party?

I'm not Miss Crepe, but I will simply ask you this, Solar. Presuming he doesn't belong in the Party, HOW DO YOU REMOVE HIM?

By supporting his opponent monetarily.
Recall, or even impeachment, depending on the offense.
Any other questions?

Several. How many are wealthy enough to support the opponents of all he/she determines is a RINO. Not just Cao, but all.

Exactly what would Cao, r any be impeached for?

Quote from: Shooterman on September 27, 2010, 04:14:00 PM
Several. How many are wealthy enough to support the opponents of all he/she determines is a RINO. Not just Cao, but all.

Exactly what would Cao, r any be impeached for?

Voting for a bill he hasn't read.  That is a no-no.

Quote from: Shooterman on September 27, 2010, 04:14:00 PM

Quote from: Solar on September 27, 2010, 03:28:19 PM

Quote from: Shooterman on September 27, 2010, 03:23:51 PM

Quote from: Solar on September 27, 2010, 03:00:46 PM

Quote from: crepe05 on September 27, 2010, 02:55:30 PM

Quote from: Dan on September 27, 2010, 02:12:34 PM
OK Crepe05, would you help us out and explain to us where you differ on the issues from Conservatives. From an issues standpoint, what makes you a RINO?

Until we all get a better handle on that one, it's hard to see how we can have a serious conversation.

Geeze, silly little ole me. I thought I was being quite serious.

I differ big time on the conservatives opinion and lack of use for the republicans who are more moderate than they.  I believe I made that very clear.  That's actually the big complaint that I have against conservatives, true or not.  Also I hate that term "true conservative".  It reeks of snobbishness and closed mindedness.

I want our party to be open to all citizens.  I view conservatives as wanting to close the party to those who don't agree with them.  I believe in the conservative political values.  I don't believe in their treatment of those who don't believe as they do.  That's when I get angry.  Again I'll say that it's real anger, not "having a bad day anger".  I think that conservatives need to get as many people as possible in their party, and as the people mature and grow older they become more conservative themselves.  I was more liberal in my twenties and then I grew up.  Not wanting moderates in the party is just insane from my viewpoint

It's not the party's issues, it's their pomposity as I see it..

crepe were asking for an actual example, not a vague description.

Let me give you an example of a RINO.
Republican, Joseph Cao, he was the only Pub to vote in favor of obama care.

Do you think he belongs in the Party?

I'm not Miss Crepe, but I will simply ask you this, Solar. Presuming he doesn't belong in the Party, HOW DO YOU REMOVE HIM?

By supporting his opponent monetarily.
Recall, or even impeachment, depending on the offense.
Any other questions?

Several. How many are wealthy enough to support the opponents of all he/she determines is a RINO. Not just Cao, but all.

Exactly what would Cao, r any be impeached for?

How thick are you shooter?
Lets take Soros for example, he blatantly funds opponents all the time, so yes, they are out there.
As to impeachment, I said dependent upon the charge, but I see you skimmed right over the easiest means of removal, "Recall"!

Quote from: Solar on September 27, 2010, 04:20:07 PM

Quote from: Shooterman on September 27, 2010, 04:14:00 PM

Quote from: Solar on September 27, 2010, 03:28:19 PM

Quote from: Shooterman on September 27, 2010, 03:23:51 PM

Quote from: Solar on September 27, 2010, 03:00:46 PM

Quote from: crepe05 on September 27, 2010, 02:55:30 PM

Quote from: Dan on September 27, 2010, 02:12:34 PM
OK Crepe05, would you help us out and explain to us where you differ on the issues from Conservatives. From an issues standpoint, what makes you a RINO?

Until we all get a better handle on that one, it's hard to see how we can have a serious conversation.

Geeze, silly little ole me. I thought I was being quite serious.

I differ big time on the conservatives opinion and lack of use for the republicans who are more moderate than they.  I believe I made that very clear.  That's actually the big complaint that I have against conservatives, true or not.  Also I hate that term "true conservative".  It reeks of snobbishness and closed mindedness.

I want our party to be open to all citizens.  I view conservatives as wanting to close the party to those who don't agree with them.  I believe in the conservative political values.  I don't believe in their treatment of those who don't believe as they do.  That's when I get angry.  Again I'll say that it's real anger, not "having a bad day anger".  I think that conservatives need to get as many people as possible in their party, and as the people mature and grow older they become more conservative themselves.  I was more liberal in my twenties and then I grew up.  Not wanting moderates in the party is just insane from my viewpoint

It's not the party's issues, it's their pomposity as I see it..

crepe were asking for an actual example, not a vague description.

Let me give you an example of a RINO.
Republican, Joseph Cao, he was the only Pub to vote in favor of obama care.

Do you think he belongs in the Party?

I'm not Miss Crepe, but I will simply ask you this, Solar. Presuming he doesn't belong in the Party, HOW DO YOU REMOVE HIM?

By supporting his opponent monetarily.
Recall, or even impeachment, depending on the offense.
Any other questions?

Several. How many are wealthy enough to support the opponents of all he/she determines is a RINO. Not just Cao, but all.

Exactly what would Cao, r any be impeached for?

How thick are you shooter?
Lets take Soros for example, he blatantly funds opponents all the time, so yes, they are out there.
As to impeachment, I said dependent upon the charge, but I see you skimmed right over the easiest means of removal, "Recall"!

Sorry, Solar, but Soros has considerably more money than I do.

As for 'recall'? That is for his constituents to decide. It certainly is not mine. Yours? Maybe so.

Quote from: Shooterman on September 27, 2010, 04:37:11 PM

Quote from: Solar on September 27, 2010, 04:20:07 PM

Quote from: Shooterman on September 27, 2010, 04:14:00 PM

Quote from: Solar on September 27, 2010, 03:28:19 PM

Quote from: Shooterman on September 27, 2010, 03:23:51 PM

Quote from: Solar on September 27, 2010, 03:00:46 PM

Quote from: crepe05 on September 27, 2010, 02:55:30 PM

Quote from: Dan on September 27, 2010, 02:12:34 PM
OK Crepe05, would you help us out and explain to us where you differ on the issues from Conservatives. From an issues standpoint, what makes you a RINO?

Until we all get a better handle on that one, it's hard to see how we can have a serious conversation.

Geeze, silly little ole me. I thought I was being quite serious.

I differ big time on the conservatives opinion and lack of use for the republicans who are more moderate than they.  I believe I made that very clear.  That's actually the big complaint that I have against conservatives, true or not.  Also I hate that term "true conservative".  It reeks of snobbishness and closed mindedness.

I want our party to be open to all citizens.  I view conservatives as wanting to close the party to those who don't agree with them.  I believe in the conservative political values.  I don't believe in their treatment of those who don't believe as they do.  That's when I get angry.  Again I'll say that it's real anger, not "having a bad day anger".  I think that conservatives need to get as many people as possible in their party, and as the people mature and grow older they become more conservative themselves.  I was more liberal in my twenties and then I grew up.  Not wanting moderates in the party is just insane from my viewpoint

It's not the party's issues, it's their pomposity as I see it..

crepe were asking for an actual example, not a vague description.

Let me give you an example of a RINO.
Republican, Joseph Cao, he was the only Pub to vote in favor of obama care.

Do you think he belongs in the Party?

I'm not Miss Crepe, but I will simply ask you this, Solar. Presuming he doesn't belong in the Party, HOW DO YOU REMOVE HIM?

By supporting his opponent monetarily.
Recall, or even impeachment, depending on the offense.
Any other questions?

Several. How many are wealthy enough to support the opponents of all he/she determines is a RINO. Not just Cao, but all.

Exactly what would Cao, r any be impeached for?

How thick are you shooter?
Lets take Soros for example, he blatantly funds opponents all the time, so yes, they are out there.
As to impeachment, I said dependent upon the charge, but I see you skimmed right over the easiest means of removal, "Recall"!

Sorry, Solar, but Soros has considerably more money than I do.

As for 'recall'? That is for his constituents to decide. It certainly is not mine. Yours? Maybe so.

Did I say otherwise?

I find it interesting for someone that has claimed to be a ardent Conservative, that railed against the Pubs losing their way, that you are suddenly taking the Devils advocacy position on the issue.

Are you, or are you not for cleaning up the party?

Quote from: Solar on September 27, 2010, 03:00:46 PM

Quote from: crepe05 on September 27, 2010, 02:55:30 PM

Quote from: Dan on September 27, 2010, 02:12:34 PM
OK Crepe05, would you help us out and explain to us where you differ on the issues from Conservatives. From an issues standpoint, what makes you a RINO?

Until we all get a better handle on that one, it's hard to see how we can have a serious conversation.

Geeze, silly little ole me. I thought I was being quite serious.

I differ big time on the conservatives opinion and lack of use for the republicans who are more moderate than they.  I believe I made that very clear.  That's actually the big complaint that I have against conservatives, true or not.  Also I hate that term "true conservative".  It reeks of snobbishness and closed mindedness.

I want our party to be open to all citizens.  I view conservatives as wanting to close the party to those who don't agree with them.  I believe in the conservative political values.  I don't believe in their treatment of those who don't believe as they do.  That's when I get angry.  Again I'll say that it's real anger, not "having a bad day anger".  I think that conservatives need to get as many people as possible in their party, and as the people mature and grow older they become more conservative themselves.  I was more liberal in my twenties and then I grew up.  Not wanting moderates in the party is just insane from my viewpoint

It's not the party's issues, it's their pomposity as I see it..

crepe were asking for an actual example, not a vague description.


Let me give you an example of a RINO.
Republican, Joseph Cao, he was the only Pub to vote in favor of obama care.

Do you think he belongs in the Part

Yes, because he is a Republican in the city of New Orleans.  He represents the poor blacks in that area.  He was voting as his constituents wanted him to.  The liberals are very liberal down there.  Cao was trying to survive.  He was the best of the lot for the Republicans.

My description wasn't vague.  I said it was the pomposity of the conservatives.  Pomposity is not a vague word and I don't use it lightly.  I can put it in simpler words.  Their poop doesn't stink but everyone elses does.  I'm not being sarcastic.  That's how I view the treatment of the so-called RINO by the true conservative.  Geeze, even the "true' is pompous.

Quote from: crepe05 on September 27, 2010, 02:55:30 PM

Quote from: Dan on September 27, 2010, 02:12:34 PM
OK Crepe05, would you help us out and explain to us where you differ on the issues from Conservatives. From an issues standpoint, what makes you a RINO?

Until we all get a better handle on that one, it's hard to see how we can have a serious conversation.

Geeze, silly little ole me. I thought I was being quite serious.

I differ big time on the conservatives opinion and lack of use for the republicans who are more moderate than they.  I believe I made that very clear.  That's actually the big complaint that I have against conservatives, true or not.  Also I hate that term "true conservative".  It reeks of snobbishness and closed mindedness.

I want our party to be open to all citizens.  I view conservatives as wanting to close the party to those who don't agree with them.  I believe in the conservative political values.  I don't believe in their treatment of those who don't believe as they do.  That's when I get angry.  Again I'll say that it's real anger, not "having a bad day anger".  I think that conservatives need to get as many people as possible in their party, and as the people mature and grow older they become more conservative themselves.  I was more liberal in my twenties and then I grew up.  Not wanting moderates in the party is just insane from my viewpoint

It's not the party's issues, it's their pomposity as I see it..

I think you're being a little unfair.

The Republican party's open to all citizens. If a committed Marxist wanted to join the Republican party I can assure you the membership committee won't raise any objections. As long as our little Marxist's check cleared he'd be in.

Things change a bit when you want to run for some representative position. I want to be represented by someone who, at least nominally, is representative of me. Someone with whom I have enough in the way of overlap of opinions that they're acceptable to me. That won't be a Marxist. If that seems exclusionary to you then I'm not sure where we can have a meeting of the minds.

I don't believe some critical percentage of under-represented views are necessary among elected officials to prove the tolerance and magnanimity of the Republican party. That's not the way a representative form of government works.

As to the rough handling that RINOs get on conservative web sites, all I can say is "toughen up". Beyond the mob mentality of trying to appear fiercer then though there are real grievences and those draw forth intemperate language. But they are, after all, just words which is what I'd say to moderates who return the favor with dismissals of, say Second Amendment activists, as barrel-heads.

The fact is, the country, heck, the human race, is moving to the right.

That means you can stay where you are, politically, and find yourself with a whole, new set of friends.

The political parties, to stay viable, to attract votes will adapt and that means moving with the public. So Arlen Spectre wasn't expelled from the Republican party and he was right that the Republican party had changed. But that change had rendered Spectre a fringe figure in the Republican party who rather then adapting to the changing circumstances had made marginalized himself by his refusal to do so.

Fine lets cut to the meat of the matter, I posted an entire thread explaining RINO.
http://conservativepoliticalforum.com/index.php?topic=42.0
read it through and you will see the point we are trying to make.

And yes, I do understand your point, and it is a valid one, but with that said, we merely get more of the same when we have too many liberals in the Party, that keep raising our debt beyond repayment.

I might add, you are the only one invoking "True" Conservative.

Quote from: Solar on September 27, 2010, 04:43:19 PM

Did I say otherwise?

I find it interesting for someone that has claimed to be a ardent Conservative, that railed against the Pubs losing their way, that you are suddenly taking the Devils advocacy position on the issue.

Are you, or are you not for cleaning up the party?

Truthfully, Solar, with all due respect, being a conservative is not synonymous with being a Republican. I truly believe the bane of this country has been the two party system, specifically the PUBS ( nee WHIGS ) and DIMS which have fallen so far from their Jeffersonian roots as to be unrecognizable. If both parties rolled over like dead armadillos tomorrow, it would be 160 years too late. I am not sure either party is worth saving, nor do I particularly care if either is saved. The problem is destroying one and not destroying the other, as well, will be a useless gesture.

Fifty years ago, I became a PUB, but managed to outgrow it about 5 years ago. 160 years ago, I would have been a Democrat and would have fought tooth and nail against the Yankee Blue Belly Republican bastards that wanted to destroy my hearth and home, kith and kin.

I know of no other way to put it mildly or kindly.

Quote from: Shooterman on September 27, 2010, 05:12:01 PM

Quote from: Solar on September 27, 2010, 04:43:19 PM

Did I say otherwise?

I find it interesting for someone that has claimed to be a ardent Conservative, that railed against the Pubs losing their way, that you are suddenly taking the Devils advocacy position on the issue.

Are you, or are you not for cleaning up the party?

Truthfully, Solar, with all due respect, being a conservative is not synonymous with being a Republican. I truly believe the bane of this country has been the two party system, specifically the PUBS ( nee WHIGS ) and DIMS which have fallen so far from their Jeffersonian roots as to be unrecognizable. If both parties rolled over like dead armadillos tomorrow, it would be 160 years too late. I am not sure either party is worth saving, nor do I particularly care if either is saved. The problem is destroying one and not destroying the other, as well, will be a useless gesture.

Fifty years ago, I became a PUB, but managed to outgrow it about 5 years ago. 160 years ago, I would have been a Democrat and would have fought tooth and nail against the Yankee Blue Belly Republican bastards that wanted to destroy my hearth and home, kith and kin.

I know of no other way to put it mildly or kindly.

In other words, you have no voice?