Navy Ship Collision: UPDATE: Was It Deliberate?

Started by Solar, June 17, 2017, 09:50:04 AM

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Solar

Quote from: Billy's bayonet on June 21, 2017, 03:49:34 PM
Lots of Militant Muslims in the Philippines....just sayin'
That was the reason I thought they weren't releasing the Captain of the ACX' name, I would have bet it was Mohamad or some sand crab loser, then again, he still could be a muscum.
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Ms.Independence

Quote from: Solar on June 21, 2017, 03:58:02 PM
That was the reason I thought they weren't releasing the Captain of the ACX' name, I would have bet it was Mohamad or some sand crab loser, then again, he still could be a muscum.

Well, I can't find out any other information on the captain of the ACX other than his name. Google search shows no other information; he may be a Fillipino, but you are correct he may be of Muslim descent, have muslim ties, radicalized Muslim ... who knows at this point. 
When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another...Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed...

Solar

Quote from: Ms.Independence on June 21, 2017, 04:40:36 PM
Well, I can't find out any other information on the captain of the ACX other than his name. Google search shows no other information; he may be a Fillipino, but you are correct he may be of Muslim descent, have muslim ties, radicalized Muslim ... who knows at this point.
With this info out, it won't be long before people start talking, that know him.
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Dubinsky

Not sure if this is to be believed since it doesn't explain the "U-turn" other than to say the autopilot could have been hacked.


Freighter Was On Autopilot When It Hit U.S. Destroyer


The Philippines-flagged cargo ship ACX Crystal was under control of a computerized navigation system that was steering and guiding the container vessel, according to officials familiar with preliminary results of an ongoing Navy investigation.

Investigators so far found no evidence the collision was deliberate.

Nevertheless, an accident during computerized navigation raises the possibility the container ship's computer system could have been hacked and the ship deliberately steered into the USS Fitzgerald, an Arleigh Burke-class guided missile destroyer.

A more likely explanation is that collision was the result of an autopilot malfunction, or the autopilot's warning signals, used to notify the ship's operators, were missed.

http://freebeacon.com/national-security/freighter-autopilot-hit-us-destroyer/

Solar

Quote from: Dubinsky on June 23, 2017, 08:54:04 AM
Not sure if this is to be believed since it doesn't explain the "U-turn" other than to say the autopilot could have been hacked.


Freighter Was On Autopilot When It Hit U.S. Destroyer


The Philippines-flagged cargo ship ACX Crystal was under control of a computerized navigation system that was steering and guiding the container vessel, according to officials familiar with preliminary results of an ongoing Navy investigation.

Investigators so far found no evidence the collision was deliberate.

Nevertheless, an accident during computerized navigation raises the possibility the container ship's computer system could have been hacked and the ship deliberately steered into the USS Fitzgerald, an Arleigh Burke-class guided missile destroyer.

A more likely explanation is that collision was the result of an autopilot malfunction, or the autopilot's warning signals, used to notify the ship's operators, were missed.

http://freebeacon.com/national-security/freighter-autopilot-hit-us-destroyer/
I smell the makings of a cover-up in its early stages.
To believe a perfect storm occurred, one has to believe space aliens were in control of the minds of both crews.

First off:

QuotePrivate naval analyst Steffan Watkins said the course data indicates the ship was running on autopilot. "The ACX Crystal  powered out of the deviation it performed at 1:30, which was likely the impact with the USS Fitzgerald, pushing it off course while trying to free itself from being hung on the bow below the waterline," Watkins told the Free Beacon.

The ship then continued to sail on for another 15 minutes, increasing speed before eventually reducing speed and turning around. "This shows the autopilot was engaged because nobody would power out of an accident with another ship and keep sailing back on course. It's unthinkable," he added.
What a dumb ass! UNLESS  IT WAS DELIBERATE, you moron! Already he is discounting the fact that this may have been a deliberate maneuver, hacked or otherwise.

Now they want us to believe that everyone on the Fitzgerald was either asleep or turned off all their systems?

QuoteFor the Navy, investigators are trying to determine why the ship's radar and other sensors did not detect the Crystal in time to take steps to avoid the collision.

The Fitzgerald is equipped with the AN/SPS-64 advanced military navigation radar, and also uses a commercial radar system to enhance the shipping traffic picture of ships in its vicinity.

Navy ships operate radar systems to detect approaching ships or submarines. Lookouts posted on the bridge are responsible for detecting ships that pose a risk of collision.

Additionally, all commercial ships over 300 tons are required under international rules to operate AIS location data. AIS information from Crystal should have been monitored by sailors on the bridge of the Fitzgerald.
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Dubinsky

Quote from: Solar on June 23, 2017, 10:16:33 AM
I smell the makings of a cover-up in its early stages.
To believe a perfect storm occurred, one has to believe space aliens were in control of the minds of both crews.

First off:
What a dumb ass! UNLESS  IT WAS DELIBERATE, you moron! Already he is discounting the fact that this may have been a deliberate maneuver, hacked or otherwise.

Now they want us to believe that everyone on the Fitzgerald was either asleep or turned off all their systems?

Yep it sure smells like one.

Billy's bayonet

Might this whole incident be tied in to the current state of affairs in the Philippines

I am wondering where the guided missile cruiser was headed? Could the disputed area of the Philippines be its classified destination? Has the US agreed to back Duterte's war against the Militant Muslims? Like we did previously under Bush? Blasting the shit out of Abu Sayeef militants?

Also just because the merchant ship is registered in the Philippines it doesn't mean it has a Filipino crew.....it could, or it might which raises other questions, are they Filipino Muslim's?
Evil operates best when under a disguise

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Solar

Quote from: Billy's bayonet on June 24, 2017, 10:01:00 AM
Might this whole incident be tied in to the current state of affairs in the Philippines

I am wondering where the guided missile cruiser was headed? Could the disputed area of the Philippines be its classified destination? Has the US agreed to back Duterte's war against the Militant Muslims? Like we did previously under Bush? Blasting the shit out of Abu Sayeef militants?

Also just because the merchant ship is registered in the Philippines it doesn't mean it has a Filipino crew.....it could, or it might which raises other questions, are they Filipino Muslim's?
Given the secrecy surrounding the ACX that's an entirely plausible scenario, Billy.
There's been no mention of the ACX crew's makeup, what their nationality is, who hired them or when they were hired, did they come from another shipping company?
But we know virtually everything about the American Navy crew? We now know the inferred message is that the crew of the Fitzgerald is incompetent, that no one was on deck watching, that all radar must have been malfunctioning and/or the entire crew was either asleep or derelict in their assigned duties for not alerting command of the ships electronics failure. :rolleyes:

That's assuming anyone is stupid enough to believe the idiot authors narrative in the article, which I'm almost certain the Pentagon fed to him verbatim.

Remember when commercials made the shift to "Men stupid, women Smarter" back in the 80's? That's what this article smells like, that the American Navy must be so incompetent, that they allowed themselves to be overtaken by a lumbering freighter.

In the past when an accident occurred, the Captain was relegated to desk duty assuming he still wore the uniform, but I'm willing to bet this commander will be quietly reassigned to another ship with the promise he keeps his mouth shut. This will be the evidence that he was never at fault, to begin with.
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Ms.Independence

When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another...Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed...

Solar

Quote from: Ms.Independence on June 25, 2017, 06:00:13 AM
The only new reports that I can find is that the incident still makes no sense and that the ACX was on auto pilot.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/m/7a23bc41-1e58-319a-9e7a-0e53486c4503/ss_uss-fitzgerald-tragedy-still.html

http://freebeacon.com/national-security/freighter-autopilot-hit-us-destroyer/
See my post above. But you're right, the "Autopilot" excuse answer lie seems to be the narrative they're going with.
I'm not buying it for a second.
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quiller

From Military.com --- note date. Why haven't they released preliminary findings?

QuoteAssociated Press | 22 Jun 2017 | by Mari Yamaguchi

TOKYO — Japanese authorities said Thursday they have obtained a data recording device from a container ship to help determine why it collided with a U.S. destroyer, killing seven American sailors.

Japanese transport safety officials said they obtained the voyage data recorder, similar to an airplane's "black box," from the Philippine-flagged ACX Crystal, which is currently docked in Yokohama near Tokyo.

Investigators are examining the ship's movements, including its location, direction, speed and other data to determine the cause of its collision with the USS Fitzgerald early Saturday off Izu Peninsula, west of Tokyo.

"By analyzing the data, we should be able to determine the circumstances of how it crashed," Transport Safety Board spokesman Katsunori Takahashi said.

The safety board is focusing on the cause of the collision and the lessons to be learned, while Japan's coast guard is investigating possible professional negligence in the accident.

http://www.military.com/daily-news/2017/06/22/investigators-obtain-data-recorder-us-warship-collision.html

quiller

Same source...

The U.S. Navy has named its own lead investigator.

QuoteYOKOTA AIR BASE, Japan -- Rear Adm. Brian Fort will lead a Navy investigation into the collision that killed seven USS Fitzgerald sailors off the Japanese coast, a 7th Fleet statement said Friday.

http://www.military.com/daily-news/2017/06/23/navy-names-lead-investigator-uss-fitzgerald-collision.html

Hoofer

Note:  I know nothing about how the Navy operates, so maybe I'm asking the wrong questions.

a.  Isn't someone on "watch" 24/7 on a military vessel?   Did that go out with sailing ships & the dude in the crow's nest?   Even with passive detection, how the heck wouldn't you know a ship is near or steaming towards you?
b.  If it's a secret mission, I guess radar or anything that emits a trackable signal would be turned off, right?  How did the cargo ship chase down the American Destroyer...?  Wouldn't the cargo ship's active radar be detectable by the navy ship's passive radar, if they were in radio silence?
c.  Auto-pilot - that's laughable, and of course it was probably hacked, unless... someone communicated with the cargo ship, and told someone to reverse course to chase down a destroyer and ram the crap out of it.

IMHO - we're missing some key elements from both ships.  This isn't 2 speed boats accidentally colliding at 45 knots - what am I not "getting" about this, what's missing here???
All animals are created equal; Some just take longer to cook.   Survival is keeping an eye on those around you...

Solar

Quote from: Hoofer on June 25, 2017, 07:14:52 AM
Note:  I know nothing about how the Navy operates, so maybe I'm asking the wrong questions.

a. Isn't someone on "watch" 24/7 on a military vessel?   Did that go out with sailing ships & the dude in the crow's nest?   Even with passive detection, how the heck wouldn't you know a ship is near or steaming towards you?
b.  If it's a secret mission, I guess radar or anything that emits a trackable signal would be turned off, right?  How did the cargo ship chase down the American Destroyer...?  Wouldn't the cargo ship's active radar be detectable by the navy ship's passive radar, if they were in radio silence?
c.  Auto-pilot - that's laughable, and of course it was probably hacked, unless... someone communicated with the cargo ship, and told someone to reverse course to chase down a destroyer and ram the crap out of it.

IMHO - we're missing some key elements from both ships.  This isn't 2 speed boats accidentally colliding at 45 knots - what am I not "getting" about this, what's missing here???
Yes!!! To the most obvious question, everyone is asking and getting no answers to.
It's for this reason I called fraud on the author of the most recent article I posted. He, in so many words, claimed dereliction of duty because he personally had no evidence that procedure had been followed.
According to a website by a former Admiral, states that no less than two spotters be on duty on deck 24/7, that there are several redundant systems for avoidance that scream out alarms in the event the computer sees impending danger.
No doubt Hell was breaking loose on the bridge as the Fitz was desperately trying to avoid a sneak attack by a vessel playing dead in the water.

Yes, I went there because a multi billion dollar piece of equipment is on the line as well as hundreds of lives at stake, and to even assume they were all derelict in their duties is pure bull shit.
But that seems to be the narrative the Pentagon wants to go with. :sneaky:
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Solar

AP story anonymous source.
"account from one of those directly involved" WTF AP, you still don't have names?

TOKYO, June 26 (Reuters) - A U.S. warship struck by a container vessel in Japanese waters failed to respond to warning signals or take evasive action before a collision that killed seven of its crew, according to a report of the incident by the Philippine cargo ship's captain.

Multiple U.S. and Japanese investigations are under way into how the guided missile destroyer USS Fitzgerald and the much larger ACX Crystal container ship collided in clear weather south of Tokyo Bay in the early hours of June 17.

In the first detailed account from one of those directly involved, the cargo ship's captain said the ACX Crystal had signalled with flashing lights after the Fitzgerald "suddenly" steamed on to a course to cross its path.

The container ship steered hard to starboard (right) to avoid the warship, but hit the Fitzgerald 10 minutes later at 1:30 a.m., according to a copy of Captain Ronald Advincula's report to Japanese ship owner Dainichi Investment Corporation that was seen by Reuters.

The U.S. Navy declined to comment and Reuters was not able to independently verify the account.

The collision tore a gash below the Fitzgerald's waterline, killing seven sailors in what was the greatest loss of life on a U.S. Navy vessel since the USS Cole was bombed in Yemen's Aden harbour in 2000.

Those who died were in their berthing compartments, while the Fitzgerald's commander was injured in his cabin, suggesting that no alarm warning of an imminent collision was sounded.

A spokesman for the U.S. Navy's Seventh Fleet in Yokosuka, the Fitzgerald's home port, said he was unable to comment on an ongoing investigation.

The incident has spurred six investigations, including two internal hearings by the U.S. Navy and a probe by the United States Coast Guard (USCG) on behalf of the National Transportation Safety Board. The Japan Transport Safety Board, the JCG and the Philippines government are also conducting separate investigations.

Spokesmen from the Japan Coast Guard (JCG), U.S. Coast Guard and ship owner, Dainichi Invest, also declined to comment. Reuters was not able to contact Advincula, who was no longer in Japan.

The investigations will examine witness testimony and electronic data to determine how a naval destroyer fitted with sophisticated radar could be struck by a vessel more than three times its size.

Another focus of the probes has been the length of time it took the ACX Crystal to report the collision. The JCG says it was first notified at 2:25 a.m., nearly an hour after the accident.

In his report, the ACX Crystal's captain said there was "confusion" on his ship's bridge, and that it turned around and returned to the collision site after continuing for 6 nautical miles (11 km).

Shipping data in Thomson Reuters Eikon shows that the ACX Crystal, chartered by Japan's Nippon Yusen KK, made a complete U-turn between 12:58 a.m. and 2:46 a.m. (Reporting by Tim Kelly; Additional reporting by Nobuhiro Kubo; Editing by Alex Richardson)

http://news.trust.org/item/20170626101937-6xsul
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