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General Category => Political Discussion and Debate => Topic started by: taxed on March 23, 2017, 03:38:20 PM

Title: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: taxed on March 23, 2017, 03:38:20 PM
We're going to need another tombstone here please...

http://therightscoop.com/breaking-vote-cancelled/

Thank you to the Freedom Caucus for holding firm.

Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: Solar on March 23, 2017, 03:45:28 PM
ROFL!!! The Marxists can't afford a loss to TEA. Any loss will be proof that the Establishment is losing it's death grip on the GOP. :thumbsup:
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: taxed on March 23, 2017, 04:07:11 PM
Quote from: Solar on March 23, 2017, 03:45:28 PM
ROFL!!! The Marxists can't afford a loss to TEA. Any loss will be proof that the Establishment is losing it's death grip on the GOP. :thumbsup:

The best thing is the RINOs are getting exposed in a major way:

http://theresurgent.com/thank-you-house-freedom-caucus/

QuoteEstablishment Republicans are coordinating an attack on conservative House Freedom Caucus members, blaming them for scuttling the Obamacare tickling plan. All House Freedom Caucus members did was insist the GOP keep its promises.

There were several ways they could have done that.

First, they could have sent the Senate an actual repeal bill and let the chair rule that it was in order under the Byrd rule. That was the easiest and best option and could have gotten it through.

Second, they could have used their 2015 legislation that they all supported as the framework for the new legislation.

Third, they could have just passed the 2015 legislation.

It was easy.

But it was the moderates who refused. Moderates decided they could not do full repeal. Moderates decided they had to keep a massive government entitlement plan. Moderates decided they needed to expand Medicaid. Moderates decided they could not get rid of the regulations.

All the House Freedom Caucus wanted was for the Republicans to keep their promises. But the GOP, led by moderates, decided to break their promise.

Now that they have been exposed, they are blaming the House Freedom Caucus. Remember, Senator Mike Lee just yesterday said the Senate Parliamentarian would have allowed repeal of regulations with the plan. That exposes the lie. Moderate Republicans do not want the regulations repealed.


Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: tac on March 23, 2017, 04:13:49 PM
The 2018 elections will probably see some of these 'moderates' (RINOS) in the unemployment line.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: Solar on March 23, 2017, 04:14:18 PM
Quote from: taxed on March 23, 2017, 04:07:11 PM
The best thing is the RINOs are getting exposed in a major way:

http://theresurgent.com/thank-you-house-freedom-caucus/
This is the oddity that the media isn't getting. No matter how hard they try and ignore, distract or obfuscate, the truth is getting out and no matter how much the Marxists pay trolls and Robo Faceplants to post, the truth is getting out because no one ios paying any attention to the media anymore.
Every day I see more and more evidence of people exposing the "Fake" news outlets to the point of embarrassment.

So the NY Slimes may write a hit piece on TEA over the Marxist defeat, but only hardcore leftists will give it any credence, furthering their demise as the party slips further into quicksand.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: tac on March 23, 2017, 04:16:51 PM
Damn TEA has more lives than a cat!   :laugh:
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: taxed on March 23, 2017, 04:18:45 PM
Quote from: tac on March 23, 2017, 04:13:49 PM
The 2018 elections will probably see some of these 'moderates' (RINOS) in the unemployment line.

I really hope so.  Watch a bunch of them scramble back to supporting and aligning with the Freedom Caucus.  Wisconsin 1st District needs to churn out that turd that keeps getting re-elected.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: tac on March 23, 2017, 04:21:30 PM
Quote from: taxed on March 23, 2017, 04:18:45 PM
I really hope so.  Watch a bunch of them scramble back to supporting and aligning with the Freedom Caucus.  Wisconsin 1st District needs to churn out that turd that keeps getting re-elected.

If the voters are that stupid, they are insane.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: taxed on March 23, 2017, 04:21:35 PM
Quote from: Solar on March 23, 2017, 04:14:18 PM
This is the oddity that the media isn't getting. No matter how hard they try and ignore, distract or obfuscate, the truth is getting out and no matter how much the Marxists pay trolls and Robo Faceplants to post, the truth is getting out because no one ios paying any attention to the media anymore.
Every day I see more and more evidence of people exposing the "Fake" news outlets to the point of embarrassment.

So the NY Slimes may write a hit piece on TEA over the Marxist defeat, but only hardcore leftists will give it any credence, furthering their demise as the party slips further into quicksand.

What's been funny to me is the pressure the President put on Congress squeezed out the squishy ones who are now exposed.  The conservatives held tight, while some got weak knees.  The President also now knows who will stand firm against him, which will be good for us.  I see this as a pretty good stress test so far.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: Solar on March 23, 2017, 04:25:53 PM
Quote from: taxed on March 23, 2017, 04:21:35 PM
What's been funny to me is the pressure the President put on Congress squeezed out the squishy ones who are now exposed.  The conservatives held tight, while some got weak knees.  The President also now knows who will stand firm against him, which will be good for us.  I see this as a pretty good stress test so far.
That's the thing, he is seeing how the country reacted and just how much we are against this passing.
I don't think he wants any part of it for fear of retribution from his base. It's too early to piss of the Trumpanzees.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: ldub23 on March 23, 2017, 04:49:25 PM
Im going to predict the House passes the  bill tomorrow.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: taxed on March 23, 2017, 04:50:04 PM
Quote from: ldub23 on March 23, 2017, 04:49:25 PM
Im going to predict the House passes the  bill tomorrow.

This very same bill?
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: walkstall on March 23, 2017, 05:19:12 PM
Quote from: tac on March 23, 2017, 04:16:51 PM
Damn TEA has more lives than a cat!   :laugh:

I ordered 10.000 more new tombstone for this year.  I only had 2 leftover from 2016.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: Possum on March 23, 2017, 05:51:43 PM
Quote from: taxed on March 23, 2017, 04:21:35 PM
What's been funny to me is the pressure the President put on Congress squeezed out the squishy ones who are now exposed.  The conservatives held tight, while some got weak knees.  The President also now knows who will stand firm against him, which will be good for us.  I see this as a pretty good stress test so far.
What is hilarious is all the dims who voted against this bill. Hate to tell them this but that bill was the best they would have got, it now has to try to get tea on board and for a dead movement they are pretty strong.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: Cryptic Bert on March 23, 2017, 06:04:08 PM
Is it over again?
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: mrconservative on March 23, 2017, 07:16:13 PM
So now Trump is telling the GOP that if they don't vote tomorrow and pass the bill as is, he will keep Obamacare.

Apparently if all else fails for Trump, try strong armed ultimatums.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: taxed on March 23, 2017, 07:20:28 PM
Quote from: mrconservative on March 23, 2017, 07:16:13 PM
So now Trump is telling the GOP that if they don't vote tomorrow and pass the bill as is, he will keep Obamacare.

Apparently if all else fails for Trump, try strong armed ultimatums.

I like it.  It puts pressure on the RINOs.  The conservatives aren't (hopefully) budging until the bill repeals the bill.  The RINOs need to go to their lobbyists and donors and beg for some wiggle room.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: Ms.Independence on March 23, 2017, 07:51:31 PM
Quote from: The Boo Man... on March 23, 2017, 06:04:08 PM
Is it over again?

Nah ... the fat woman still hasn't sung.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: Cryptic Bert on March 23, 2017, 09:00:57 PM
Apparently changes were made but it isn't enough. Let it die and let's have the freedom caucus put together a proper bill.  It will get done because very soon the projections for next years premium increases will be released and that will put tremendous pressure on the GOP.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: ldub23 on March 24, 2017, 03:31:17 AM
Quote from: taxed on March 23, 2017, 04:50:04 PM
This very same bill?

Whatever bill they end  up voting for today. I dont like the bill but  i have  no confidence  in the freedom caucus. Afterall, they had a chance to deny Ryan the speakers job but  caved.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: Bronx on March 24, 2017, 05:54:16 AM
Quote from: s3779m on March 23, 2017, 05:51:43 PM
What is hilarious is all the dims who voted against this bill. Hate to tell them this but that bill was the best they would have got, it now has to try to get tea on board and for a dead movement they are pretty strong.

That's the part that worries me the most. Ryan going to the dems and expressing just that. They jump on board and leave the Conservatives out in the cold standing alone. Ryan can pin his healthcare Bill as one that was bipartisan. Passed by both republicans and democrats.

The only folks that hate Conservatives more then the democrats are the republican rinos.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: Solar on March 24, 2017, 06:32:35 AM
Quote from: ldub23 on March 24, 2017, 03:31:17 AM
Whatever bill they end  up voting for today. I dont like the bill but  i have  no confidence  in the freedom caucus. Afterall, they had a chance to deny Ryan the speakers job but  caved.

White House officials said late Thursday President Trump wants the House to vote Friday on the legislation to begin dismantling ObamaCare, and if it fails, he is "done with health care," and ready to move on to tax reform, a source told Fox News.

http://politistick.com/trump-pass-paul-ryans-turd-sandwich-friday-keeping-obamacare/
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: Possum on March 24, 2017, 07:06:04 AM
Quote from: Bronx on March 24, 2017, 05:54:16 AM
That's the part that worries me the most. Ryan going to the dems and expressing just that. They jump on board and leave the Conservatives out in the cold standing alone. Ryan can pin his healthcare Bill as one that was bipartisan. Passed by both republicans and democrats.

The only folks that hate Conservatives more then the democrats are the republican rinos.
Strange things can happen, and it would be really off the wall strange if the dims would join with Trump to get this passed. Maybe Trump could promise to leave it named obamacare, that might get a few votes. One factor I find alarming, Trump seems more willing to consult and try to win the support from dims rather than Tea.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: Dubinsky on March 24, 2017, 09:54:18 AM
Here's what I find ironic. Trump ran as an outsider.  Then when it comes to one of the two main cornerstones of what he ran on...he leaves it up to Ryan, the insider's insider to get it done.  :wink: We can get into strategies and whose to blame but that stands out to me for my two cents.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: Thinker on March 24, 2017, 10:45:14 AM
Quote from: Dubinsky on March 24, 2017, 09:54:18 AM
Here's what I find ironic. Trump ran as an outsider.  Then when it comes to one of the two main cornerstones of what he ran on...he leaves it up to Ryan, the insider's insider to get it done.  :wink: We can get into strategies and whose to blame but that stands out to me for my two cents.
Trump is unable to enact laws, that has to go through Congress.  The president can influence a bill and has veto power, but creating a bill is a no-no.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: Dubinsky on March 24, 2017, 11:13:07 AM
Quote from: Thinker on March 24, 2017, 10:45:14 AM
Trump is unable to enact laws, that has to go through Congress.  The president can influence a bill and has veto power, but creating a bill is a no-no.

I understand that he can not and the role of Congress. My point was that leading up to his inauguration he certainly must have spoken to Ryan.  Some "message" had to get through to Ryan on what was desired on the president's part. This bill appears to be something hastily thrown together by Ryan and Co, no matter what he says. It's as if he got out his crayons and crossed out what he didn't like and colored in what he wanted, not what the public or Trump wanted. To this moment I still don't believe Trumps knows what is or isn't in the bill or if he even understands it. IMHO. I may be in the minority but I put this more on Ryan than Trump....and I'm no died-hard Trump supporter. Either way this has been handled horribly.

Perhaps this explains some of how I see it better than I.

http://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/3/24/15039664/paul-ryan-donald-trump-ahca
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: taxed on March 24, 2017, 11:33:17 AM
Quote from: ldub23 on March 24, 2017, 03:31:17 AM
Whatever bill they end  up voting for today. I dont like the bill but  i have  no confidence  in the freedom caucus. Afterall, they had a chance to deny Ryan the speakers job but  caved.

Can you post the role call that gave Ryan the speakership please?
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: taxed on March 24, 2017, 11:36:09 AM
Quote from: Dubinsky on March 24, 2017, 09:54:18 AM
Here's what I find ironic. Trump ran as an outsider.  Then when it comes to one of the two main cornerstones of what he ran on...he leaves it up to Ryan, the insider's insider to get it done.  :wink: We can get into strategies and whose to blame but that stands out to me for my two cents.

When it fails, who takes the fall?  It exposes the RINOs even more.  The Freedom Caucus conservatives are safe and held their ground and the President can just say "my pen is waiting... someone get a repeal bill to my desk".  Plus after it fails, 2018 is looming and that will increase pressure on the squishy RINOs.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: zewazir on March 24, 2017, 11:37:50 AM
Frankly, I did not expect O-care to be tackled this early in the game.

The law in place is a convoluted, invasive, insidious, maze of regulations, requirements, mandates and oversights making a total mess of the health insurance industry. And it has been screwing things up for 7 full years as of yesterday. The idea that it could be simply repealed without looking out for, and mitigating the consequences is naive at best, massively dangerous at worst.

IMO, ACA was deliberately designed to be difficult to dismantle once put in place - just as it was deliberately designed to ultimately fail. We have the legislative equivalent of one of those "art" kinetic sculptures whose intent is to self-destruct once put in motion.

For another analogy, it's a legislative game of Jenga, where the left and right blocks have been removed from the third layer up. One wrong move and the whole thing falls down - with the republicans and Trump holding the blame bag at the end. (The media will make damned sure of that!!) It's an issue that should have been planned out with the knowledge it would take a rather significant amount of time to plan which aspects can be repealed and in what order, which need to be mitigated before being repealed, and which should be replaced with something that actually does the job of helping those who genuinely need help.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: supsalemgr on March 24, 2017, 12:33:37 PM
Quote from: Bronx on March 24, 2017, 05:54:16 AM
That's the part that worries me the most. Ryan going to the dems and expressing just that. They jump on board and leave the Conservatives out in the cold standing alone. Ryan can pin his healthcare Bill as one that was bipartisan. Passed by both republicans and democrats.

The only folks that hate Conservatives more then the democrats are the republican rinos.

I just do not see the democrats helping at all to ditch Obamacare even though this bill apparently is window dressing as far as repeal is concerned..
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: taxed on March 24, 2017, 01:00:04 PM
Pulled...

http://dailycaller.com/2017/03/24/republicans-pull-health-care-bill-just-minutes-after-members-were-scheduled-to-vote-on-it/

Sorry RINOs... you can't hide behind Hussein anymore.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: mrconservative on March 24, 2017, 01:37:42 PM
Bravo to Mark Meadows, Louie Gohmert, Jim Jordan, Dave Brat and the rest of members of the House Freedom Caucus for standing up and saying No to this shit ass Obamacare 2.0 and refusing budge.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: zewazir on March 24, 2017, 02:25:28 PM
Quote from: taxed on March 24, 2017, 01:00:04 PM
Pulled...

http://dailycaller.com/2017/03/24/republicans-pull-health-care-bill-just-minutes-after-members-were-scheduled-to-vote-on-it/

Sorry RINOs... you can't hide behind Hussein anymore.
Good. Now let some real conservative work in the background over the next several months to bring about a plan to properly get rid of ACA. It will NOT be easy to get rid of without causing a lot of disruption in the entire healthcare industry. At this juncture, outright repeal will cause too much harm for the prog media to jump all over. Impossible to operate without screwing things up, impossible to repeal without screwing things up. Of course, it was designed to be that way. They also planned for ACA itself to ultimately fail, opening the door for full-on socialized health care nation wide.

What they did NOT plan for was a spoiler like Trump taking the White House over their beloved nether regions of a Marxist jenny.

I just hope Trump can reign in his ego enough to realize the true conservative of Congress have handed him the gift of time to do things right.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: Gunbunny42 on March 24, 2017, 03:19:23 PM
Quote from: zewazir on March 24, 2017, 02:25:28 PM
Good. Now let some real conservative work in the background over the next several months to bring about a plan to properly get rid of ACA. It will NOT be easy to get rid of without causing a lot of disruption in the entire healthcare industry. At this juncture, outright repeal will cause too much harm for the prog media to jump all over. Impossible to operate without screwing things up, impossible to repeal without screwing things up. Of course, it was designed to be that way. They also planned for ACA itself to ultimately fail, opening the door for full-on socialized health care nation wide.

What they did NOT plan for was a spoiler like Trump taking the White House over their beloved nether regions of a Marxist jenny.

I just hope Trump can reign in his ego enough to realize the true conservative of Congress have handed him the gift of time to do things right.

With failure this time around, I can't see Obamacare getting repeal until after the 2018 mid terms.If Trump couldn't get the votes now he isn't going to suddenly have them in July or September, there's too many dems and rinos stinking up the place for that to happen.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: walkstall on March 24, 2017, 03:24:19 PM
Quote from: Gunbunny42 on March 24, 2017, 03:19:23 PM
With failure this time around, I can't see Obamacare getting repeal until after the 2018 mid terms.If Trump couldn't get the votes now he isn't going to suddenly have them in July or September, there's too many dems and rinos stinking up the place for that to happen.


I look at it this way, time is on Trump side now as Congress have time to do it right.   
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: Gunbunny42 on March 24, 2017, 03:47:50 PM
Quote from: walkstall on March 24, 2017, 03:24:19 PM

I look at it this way, time is on Trump side now as Congress have time to do it right.

Your right, time isn't the issue. The issue is will Congress and Trump use it wisely? Hopefully this failure will let a fire on their behinds to get this repeal done right next time around.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: taxed on March 24, 2017, 03:51:34 PM
The President after pulling the bill... I actually really like his vibe on this...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SNV_aXnw2qA
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: topside on March 24, 2017, 04:31:15 PM
After reviewing what Trump said, three things stand out:

1) He's going to let Obamacare burn down some more - let the clock tick - until the people put more pressure on the Dims and other no votes.

2) What wasn't in the dialogue was notion of repealing Obamacare and letting the free market have it back. I'm pretty sure the problem is that a lot of people would lose their subsidized healthcare and those who worry more about votes than their duty to the republic won't ever go that way because it will potentially bang them up with many voters. Even if Trump has the Kahunas, the RINOs don't and Trump can't get the backing to repeal. So I don't see a path where that can happen.

3) Trump mentioned a three-phase approach was rendered and this vote was the first phase. Maybe I've been asleep at the wheel, but did anyone else hear any details of the other two phases? That was actually news to me - despite it's absence on any MSM fake news or other actual news / information sites.

Trump should set a bill / mandate that all of congress be on Obama Care - let them wallow in the same slop as the rest of us. Since they are so much behind it, they shouldn't mind. 

I couldn't even stand to watch Scott Pelley's shitty little grin tonight. I usually see what he has to say because he pretty much represents what's broken in the MSM and he's so transparent that it's an indicator of where the MSM is going. But I just couldn't take it tonight.

Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: zewazir on March 24, 2017, 04:40:56 PM
Quote from: Gunbunny42 on March 24, 2017, 03:19:23 PM
With failure this time around, I can't see Obamacare getting repeal until after the 2018 mid terms.If Trump couldn't get the votes now he isn't going to suddenly have them in July or September, there's too many dems and rinos stinking up the place for that to happen.
The failure this time around was due to the "replacement" being way too much like what it was supposed to replace. The MISTAKE that led to the failure was trying to rush through unravelling the most convoluted, overly complicated, self-contradictory piece of crap to hit our law books since the creation of the IRS. Rather than admitting the process cannot be done quickly, and that fulfilling their pledge to rid us of ACA would take time and effort to do properly, they tried to pull a fast one (pun not intended) and got caught out by TEA-sponsored members of the congress.

The authors of ACA made sure that not only would it eventually fail utterly (with ideas of using the failure to implement full on socialized health care) but also that it would be impossible to just repeal without causing all kinds of troubles the progs could dance around like the mindless savages they are, crowing how the 'pubs broke health care.

We are just barely 3 months into Trump's administration. There is time to look at the situation, determine what parts can be outright repealed without harm, what parts have already cause enough damage they'll need to be carefully excised with temporary replacements or easements, and then figure out what can be done to actually address the problems with health care costs.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: taxed on March 24, 2017, 04:44:14 PM
Quote from: topside on March 24, 2017, 04:31:15 PM
After reviewing what Trump said, three things stand out:

1) He's going to let Obamacare burn down some more - let the clock tick - until the people put more pressure on the Dims and other no votes.
When he says Democrats, I hear RINOs.  As 2018 approaches and the ACA scam gets worse, the pressure is applied to the RINOs.  On one side is the immovable wall of the Freedom Caucus, and on the other side is a closing wall of time, like in that scene in Star Wars when they're in that trash compactor.

Quote
2) What wasn't in the dialogue was notion of repealing Obamacare and letting the free market have it back. I'm pretty sure the problem is that a lot of people would lose their subsidized healthcare and those who worry more about votes than their duty to the republic won't ever go that way because it will potentially bang them up with many voters. Even if Trump has the Kahunas, the RINOs don't and Trump can't get the backing to repeal. So I don't see a path where that can happen.
There are far more people against the ACA scam than for it.  None of these RINOs are worried about constituents.  They're worried about their donors and lobbyists that bribe and pay them off, or have video of them having sex with children, or whatever pickle they got themselves into. 

Quote
3) Trump mentioned a three-phase approach was rendered and this vote was the first phase. Maybe I've been asleep at the wheel, but did anyone else hear any details of the other two phases? That was actually news to me - despite it's absence on any MSM fake news or other actual news / information sites.

Trump should set a bill / mandate that all of congress be on Obama Care - let them wallow in the same slop as the rest of us. Since they are so much behind it, they shouldn't mind. 
I'd love them to be subject to the same laws as they inflict upon us, but for this, the rage of the constituents will bring plenty of heat for the time being.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: Cryptic Bert on March 24, 2017, 05:10:43 PM
I don't see what the big deal is. A new bill can be introduced t any time and if it passes Trump will sign it. A bill rarely if ever passes as it was written Trump and Ryan didn't give the congress enough time to debate the bill. That is more Ryan's fault than Trumps because Ryan knows how the House works. He's the leader.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: Gunbunny42 on March 24, 2017, 06:02:20 PM
Quote from: zewazir on March 24, 2017, 04:40:56 PM
The failure this time around was due to the "replacement" being way too much like what it was supposed to replace. The MISTAKE that led to the failure was trying to rush through unravelling the most convoluted, overly complicated, self-contradictory piece of crap to hit our law books since the creation of the IRS. Rather than admitting the process cannot be done quickly, and that fulfilling their pledge to rid us of ACA would take time and effort to do properly, they tried to pull a fast one (pun not intended) and got caught out by TEA-sponsored members of the congress.

The authors of ACA made sure that not only would it eventually fail utterly (with ideas of using the failure to implement full on socialized health care) but also that it would be impossible to just repeal without causing all kinds of troubles the progs could dance around like the mindless savages they are, crowing how the 'pubs broke health care.

We are just barely 3 months into Trump's administration. There is time to look at the situation, determine what parts can be outright repealed without harm, what parts have already cause enough damage they'll need to be carefully excised with temporary replacements or easements, and then figure out what can be done to actually address the problems with health care costs.

As far as the rinos are concerned if they can't vote for a watered down version of obummercare then anything actually conservative is a nonstarter. There is still too many gutless suits with an R in front of their names for that, which is why 2018 will be our next best chance toward repealing it.

And frankly a plan on how to dismantle ACA with minimal harm should have been thought of a long time ago. The party shouldn't have waited until it was in power to come up with one, that was without a doubt a mistake that came back to haunt them.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: taxed on March 24, 2017, 08:21:13 PM
Quote from: The Boo Man... on March 24, 2017, 05:10:43 PM
I don't see what the big deal is. A new bill can be introduced t any time and if it passes Trump will sign it. A bill rarely if ever passes as it was written Trump and Ryan didn't give the congress enough time to debate the bill. That is more Ryan's fault than Trumps because Ryan knows how the House works. He's the leader.

Exactly.  They have the luxury of knowing whatever they get to his desk will get signed, so it's 100% on Congress.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: quiller on March 25, 2017, 04:21:39 AM
Quote from: walkstall on March 24, 2017, 03:24:19 PM

I look at it this way, time is on Trump side now as Congress have time to do it right.

Goad the RINOs into a vote on a hasty patchwork of BS, watch it crash like a runaway planet and then let the despicable Ryan eat the vote (without catsup or other condiments).

Sit back grinning, watching the Democrat Lites tear themselves apart, as the party out of power sits back boiling in its own hate over things they cannot change.

THAT'S entertainment!  :thumbsup:

Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: supsalemgr on March 25, 2017, 04:56:02 AM
Quote from: The Boo Man... on March 24, 2017, 05:10:43 PM
I don't see what the big deal is. A new bill can be introduced t any time and if it passes Trump will sign it. A bill rarely if ever passes as it was written Trump and Ryan didn't give the congress enough time to debate the bill. That is more Ryan's fault than Trumps because Ryan knows how the House works. He's the leader.

I believe Ryan was trying to pull a fast one and the Freedom Caucus called him on it. Trump should now embrace the FC as his name will not be on a failed replacement bill. The FC is the reason Trump will not be saddled with another failed plan.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: ldub23 on March 25, 2017, 05:19:57 AM
Quote from: Gunbunny42 on March 24, 2017, 03:19:23 PM
With failure this time around, I can't see Obamacare getting repeal until after the 2018 mid terms.If Trump couldn't get the votes now he isn't going to suddenly have them in July or September, there's too many dems and rinos stinking up the place for that to happen.

2018 midterms might be a disaster. Assuming we dont get tax cuts and reform then there will be precious little reason for anyone to show to vote for reps.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: ldub23 on March 25, 2017, 05:28:21 AM
Let me also say this about the  2018 midterms. No matter how  bad Obamacare gets i think reps using it as a campaign issue will fall on deaf ears. Afterall, we expected action now and got  nothing and the  only thing that will change the next  2 years is Obamacare get further established with more people making it even less likely it gets repealed. To be honest single  payer is now the  only way out  of this mess.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: Solar on March 25, 2017, 06:10:19 AM
Quote from: ldub23 on March 25, 2017, 05:28:21 AM
Let me also say this about the  2018 midterms. No matter how  bad Obamacare gets i think reps using it as a campaign issue will fall on deaf ears. Afterall, we expected action now and got  nothing and the  only thing that will change the next  2 years is Obamacare get further established with more people making it even less likely it gets repealed. To be honest single  payer is now the  only way out  of this mess.
You completely left out TEA, why? And what gives you the idea the nation wants socialized medicine?
The dim party is dead because of it, and the RINO are close to dead trying to resurrect it.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: walkstall on March 25, 2017, 07:38:46 AM
Quote from: ldub23 on March 25, 2017, 05:28:21 AM
Let me also say this about the  2018 midterms. No matter how  bad Obamacare gets i think reps using it as a campaign issue will fall on deaf ears. Afterall, we expected action now and got  nothing and the  only thing that will change the next  2 years is Obamacare get further established with more people making it even less likely it gets repealed. To be honest single  payer is now the  only way out  of this mess.

You sound like your trying to sell something.  I see it as Conservatives saving our ass on not passing the bill. 
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: supsalemgr on March 25, 2017, 07:51:25 AM
Quote from: Solar on March 25, 2017, 06:10:19 AM
You completely left out TEA, why? And what gives you the idea the nation wants socialized medicine?
The dim party is dead because of it, and the RINO are close to dead trying to resurrect it.

What we saw yesterday was the successful culmination of all the TEA work that has been done since 2009. The naysayers have been trying bury TEA for eight years and have failed. We finally have elected enough conservatives in the House to affect outcomes. The Freedom Caucus now must be dealt with on all legislative matters. Ryan found out he cannot do anything without TEA. We still have much to do with all the RINO's in the senate.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: Solar on March 25, 2017, 07:55:36 AM
Quote from: supsalemgr on March 25, 2017, 07:51:25 AM
What we saw yesterday was the successful culmination of all the TEA work that has been done since 2009. The naysayers have been trying bury TEA for eight years and have failed. We finally have elected enough conservatives in the House to affect outcomes. The Freedom Caucus now must be dealt with on all legislative matters. Ryan found out he cannot do anything without TEA. We still have much to do with all the RINO's in the senate.
Yep! :thumbup:
This was a shot we've been readying to take for nearly a decade, and it was a direct hit through the heart of Marxists in both party's.
They now know we are a power to contend with on every level, nothing goes forward without first dealing with Conservatives. We have now turned the corner.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: walkstall on March 25, 2017, 08:10:40 AM
Quote from: supsalemgr on March 25, 2017, 07:51:25 AM
What we saw yesterday was the successful culmination of all the TEA work that has been done since 2009. The naysayers have been trying bury TEA for eight years and have failed. We finally have elected enough conservatives in the House to affect outcomes. The Freedom Caucus now must be dealt with on all legislative matters. Ryan found out he cannot do anything without TEA. We still have much to do with all the RINO's in the senate.

The President did not say a thing about the Freedom Caucus, only that it was the Dem's fault that the RINO HC did not pass. 

Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: mrconservative on March 25, 2017, 10:58:52 AM
I heard that Rep Adam Kinzinger has come out and declared that it's time for the GOP to leave those of the Freedom Caucus behind and begin negotiating with the Democrats.

"It's time"...? Gotta love how Kinzinger tries to spin it as if the GOP is still conservative and that the past decade of rubbing shoulders with the Dems didn't happen.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: supsalemgr on March 25, 2017, 11:16:00 AM
Quote from: mrconservative on March 25, 2017, 10:58:52 AM
I heard that Rep Adam Kinzinger has come out and declared that it's time for the GOP to leave those of the Freedom Caucus behind and begin negotiating with the Democrats.

"It's time"...? Gotta love how Kinzinger tries to spin it as if the GOP is still conservative and that the past decade of rubbing shoulders with the Dems didn't happen.

Further proof of the success of TEA.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: ldub23 on March 25, 2017, 03:35:07 PM
Quote from: supsalemgr on March 25, 2017, 11:16:00 AM
Further proof of the success of TEA.

We will see about that. If tax cuts dont occur then reps will be swept  out  in 2018 and Tea party will be nothing.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: ldub23 on March 25, 2017, 03:40:19 PM
Quote from: walkstall on March 25, 2017, 07:38:46 AM
You sound like your trying to sell something.  I see it as Conservatives saving our ass on not passing the bill.

Im not selling anything. Every day that passes ingraines Obamacare further into the system and we already see where reps failed  now and  it only gets more difficult as each day goes  by. If tax cuts dont  materialize then reps will suffer massive congressional losses  in 2018 and  2020 and a dem president will be elected  in 2020 and the dems will "fix" Obamacare with single  payer.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: walkstall on March 25, 2017, 04:24:10 PM
Quote from: ldub23 on March 25, 2017, 03:40:19 PM
Im not selling anything. Every day that passes ingraines Obamacare further into the system and we already see where reps failed  now and  it only gets more difficult as each day goes  by. If tax cuts dont  materialize then reps will suffer massive congressional losses  in 2018 and  2020 and a dem president will be elected  in 2020 and the dems will "fix" Obamacare with single  payer.

So Trump has been in office for 65 days.  And your looking for a rabbit coming out of his hat.  To date he has broken not laws to get something done in office.  The GOP has not locked the door to keep out the DEM's.    He has to deal with the DEM's, the GOP, The MSM, and b o.   HE IS NOT GOD...    :lol: 
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: Solar on March 25, 2017, 04:46:44 PM
Quote from: ldub23 on March 25, 2017, 03:40:19 PM
Im not selling anything. Every day that passes ingraines Obamacare further into the system and we already see where reps failed  now and  it only gets more difficult as each day goes  by. If tax cuts dont  materialize then reps will suffer massive congressional losses  in 2018 and  2020 and a dem president will be elected  in 2020 and the dems will "fix" Obamacare with single  payer.
Are you serious? How is killing another Commiecare Bill a failure? This was a TEA victory, a Marxist RINO failure, they got their asses Kicked, big time!
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: ldub23 on March 26, 2017, 04:44:05 AM
Quote from: Solar on March 25, 2017, 04:46:44 PM
Are you serious? How is killing another Commiecare Bill a failure? This was a TEA victory, a Marxist RINO failure, they got their asses Kicked, big time!

Its a huge failure if tax cuts dont materialize. How can this be a victory if  obamacare is alive and well and becoming  more difficult to unravel each day?
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: ldub23 on March 26, 2017, 04:46:33 AM
Quote from: walkstall on March 25, 2017, 04:24:10 PM
So Trump has been in office for 65 days.  And your looking for a rabbit coming out of his hat.  To date he has broken not laws to get something done in office.  The GOP has not locked the door to keep out the DEM's.    He has to deal with the DEM's, the GOP, The MSM, and b o.   HE IS NOT GOD...    :lol:

Im not blaming Trump at all. In fact i would not be surprised if Ryan wanted this to fail. Trumps biggest enemy is the GOP.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: zewazir on March 26, 2017, 07:58:55 AM
Quote from: ldub23 on March 26, 2017, 04:44:05 AM
Its a huge failure if tax cuts dont materialize. How can this be a victory if  obamacare is alive and well and becoming  more difficult to unravel each day?
O-care is already difficult to unravel. It was deliberately designed to be difficult, if not impossible to perform an outright repeal without causing unacceptable economic damage. O-care built up a fragile (designed to fail) infrastructure that cannot be ignored when the time comes to repeal/replace. As such, any attempt to get rid of ACA will have to include a plan which will dismantle O-care's structure carefully so as to minimize harm. Such is not something that can be planned and written, debated and modified in a few weeks time. That is why anyone who were expecting the new congress to simply write a repeal bill and leave it at that - including the candidates who made that a campaign promise - were promoting very unrealistic expectations.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: Solar on March 26, 2017, 08:05:34 AM
Quote from: ldub23 on March 26, 2017, 04:44:05 AM
Its a huge failure if tax cuts dont materialize. How can this be a victory if  obamacare is alive and well and becoming  more difficult to unravel each day?
The Bill Ryan proposed did nothing whatsoever to curb Commiecare. By having nothing in place allows Commiecare to expire and die on the vine, just like Trump said, if left to its own devices, libs will be begging to have it killed.

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/guybenson/2016/04/26/its-working-insurers-project-substantial-increases-in-2017-obamacare-premiums-n2154033
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: supsalemgr on March 26, 2017, 08:48:04 AM
Quote from: Solar on March 26, 2017, 08:05:34 AM
The Bill Ryan proposed did nothing whatsoever to curb Commiecare. By having nothing in place allows Commiecare to expire and die on the vine, just like Trump said, if left to its own devices, libs will be begging to have it killed.

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/guybenson/2016/04/26/its-working-insurers-project-substantial-increases-in-2017-obamacare-premiums-n2154033

The positive is the democrats still own the disaster. What Ryan had put together would have been a disaster as well and then the republicans would own it.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: Solar on March 26, 2017, 09:25:27 AM
Quote from: supsalemgr on March 26, 2017, 08:48:04 AM
The positive is the democrats still own the disaster. What Ryan had put together would have been a disaster as well and then the republicans would own it.
Exactly!!!!
Ryan literally wanted to take credit for a Dim failure. WTF is wrong with the GOP that they are so Hell bent on helping Dims out of the cesspit they dug and got stuck in?
Are we (members of this forum) the only ones that see collusion between the RINO and the Dim party and the GOP always bailing them out?
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: Hoofer on March 26, 2017, 10:35:50 AM
If the Republicans FAILED to repeal Obamacare - what was the vote?

What was the vote total?   It's still a wholly owned Democrat bill, it's THEIR healthcare system, not a single Republican voted for it.

Let it fail - the Democrats own it, let it collapse!   If the Republicans want to help rescue it - then it'd be a Republican problem, just the thing the Democrats would love (when it fails).   Like any bill, there will be something WRONG with it.

Chuck Shumer, Harry Reid & Nancy Pelosi remind me, in a twisted way, of Walter Cronkite announcing American defeat during the Viet Nam or Iraqi war(s).  Whenever we "won", it was spun as a slaughter of Americans.   Nixon's war, Bush's war, Trump's failure - whatever, they're still the party of the negatives - against anything... unless their party is behind it.  Politics above the best interests of America.  Media isn't any better, should we expect anything positive, regardless of the outcome?  Hardly.  I don't waste my time listening to these knuckleheads - that probably infuriates them even more... let's face it, your life has got to be pretty BORING to waste time watching TV or listening to political punditry.

Leave it alone, it'll run out of gas, or wreck, and the Democrats can own it.   Already ... there's Chuck Shumer reaching out to Trump, trying to get this load of Obamacare off his plate, he KNOWS this is bad, and desperately wants to the Republicans to "own it" (like the Viet Nam war).   

Trump should answer every question raised about Obamacare with simply, "It started as a Democrat bill, it was passed solely as a Democrat bill - if they thought it needed fixing, they would have voted with us - Democrats own this debacle, 100%, next question!"   Go on to do the same with ALL Democrat talking points, if they like it, they can pay to keep it afloat - and take the blame for the ill consequences.

Obamacare is failing?   Nancy Pelosi said she'd have to voted for it, to see how it was gonna fail (or what was in it, whatever).  Chuck Shumer is all behind Obamacare, he pushed it, if it doesn't work out, fire him!  They're the ones who gave us this mess, none of the Republicans voted for it - go after those career politicians who tried to steal your freedom.   It's that simple - it's a Democrat issue.

Any sensible Republican would be thanking Rand Paul & the Freedom Caucus.
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: Cryptic Bert on March 26, 2017, 06:52:34 PM
Has any of the freedom caucus members offered a bill?
Title: Re: RIP Tea Party, 3/23/2017 - GOP cancels RINOcare vote
Post by: redbeard on March 26, 2017, 06:58:01 PM
Quote from: The Boo Man... on March 26, 2017, 06:52:34 PM
Has anyone of the freedom caucus members offered a bill?
Yes! They asked for the bill that was passed by both houses last year and vetoed by Obama to be brought back up!