Just for shits and grins, II though I'd toss out some red meat for the left.
Bare with me, I'm just kidding, but I have a solution for the left's cry for free college.
Let us offer them free college, but there's a hitch, it has to be in the hard sciences, not freakin anthropology or anything like that, but actual science like math based degrees. :biggrin: (SJW run for safe spaces)
Give subsidies for trade schools in manufacturing as in engine repair, actual working trades.
How fast do you think liberal degrees would disappear?
OK, just a conversation starter, but using history as a guide, the left always gets its way, eventually, so let's kneecap them before they can institute free college for all.
Just half serious...
Fact based education will still be taught with a bias.
Quote from: Sick Of Silence on July 29, 2018, 05:20:19 PM
Fact based education will still be taught with a bias.
True, to a point, the sciences, aside from the climate scientist nonsense they recently created, math profs aren't generally politically motivated, math knows no bias.
This is why the government is in the student loan business. A bank is not going to give a student loan to someone who wants a degree in gender studies or lesbian basket weaving because they know the kid will never get a job and pay back the loan.
Quote from: Solar on July 29, 2018, 06:06:52 PM
True, to a point, the sciences, aside from the climate scientist nonsense they recently created, math profs aren't generally politically motivated, math knows no bias.
Even if they can't or don't fudge the actual information, you still have a Liberal effecting the grades.
Quote from: Sick Of Silence on July 29, 2018, 08:25:09 PM
Even if they can't or don't fudge the actual information, you still have a Liberal effecting the grades.
Nothing even remotely close to what kids are getting with a liberal arts degree or equivalent. I also said trade schools, which are generally run by conservative businessmen.
Liberalism would instantly die off. Nothing squashes liberalism like the real world, where results matter because lives are on the line, financially and literally. If you make a mistake designing a bridge and it collapses, people die. In academia, the professor knocks points off your grade, and possibly according to his politics.
Quote from: taxed on July 29, 2018, 09:27:36 PM
Liberalism would instantly die off. Nothing squashes liberalism like the real world, where results matter because lives are on the line, financially and literally. If you make a mistake designing a bridge and it collapses, people die. In academia, the professor knocks points off your grade, and possibly according to his politics.
I honestly think a case could be made for this, especially when you compare our nations math scores with other countries, we're literally in a crisis.
Not that I want it to happen, but every program leftists ever promoted, eventually took root and look where we are now.
So I can kind of see
nipping this in the bud er rather, cutting off the diseased limbs to save the tree.
Quote from: Solar on July 29, 2018, 08:38:52 PM
Nothing even remotely close to what kids are getting with a liberal arts degree or equivalent. I also said trade schools, which are generally run by conservative businessmen.
Medical school is a hard science. Are they teaching that a trans-woman is a woman instead of biologically a man? Will they screw my grade if I don't say a trans-woman is a woman? Will they push Universal Healthcare, the idea that healthcare is a right, or that making a lot of money is "greedy" or "wrong" or "not the right reason to want to be a doctor"?
Why are the discussing diversity on the application process? Are they only going to allow minorities with lower grades in and not allow white males in because I have some type of made up privilege? Do I need to start worrying about my new doctor doesn't know what they are doing?
Solar makes sense. If the government is going to subsidize college it should subsidize college as long as the kids are learning actual skills that will get them jobs so they can contribute to the economy.
Quote from: The Boo Man... on July 29, 2018, 10:09:16 PM
Solar makes sense. If the government is going to subsidize college it should subsidize college as long as the kids are learning actual skills that will get them jobs so they can contribute to the economy.
It has to be like truck driving school: We will train you but you will have to work for us.
Quote from: Sick Of Silence on July 29, 2018, 09:49:25 PM
Medical school is a hard science. Are they teaching that a trans-woman is a woman instead of biologically a man? Will they screw my grade if I don't say a trans-woman is a woman? Will they push Universal Healthcare, the idea that healthcare is a right, or that making a lot of money is "greedy" or "wrong" or "not the right reason to want to be a doctor"?
Gee, I don't know, why don't you dig up your, "What Ifs" and post them as evidence that every medical school in the country is run by leftist Profs.
QuoteWhy are the discussing diversity on the application process? Are they only going to allow minorities with lower grades in and not allow white males in because I have some type of made up privilege? Do I need to start worrying about my new doctor doesn't know what they are doing?
So you agree, with my theory, that disallowing the schools to set diversity standards, is a good idea?
Yanking money out of their hands over discrimination would kill the left, they can't exist without taxpayer money.
Quote from: The Boo Man... on July 29, 2018, 10:09:16 PM
Solar makes sense. If the government is going to subsidize college it should subsidize college as long as the kids are learning actual skills that will get them jobs so they can contribute to the economy.
Exactly!
They already steal an exorbitant amount of taxpayer dollars, probably more than enough to teach any student that wants to be a doctor.
Of course, this will have to be taken from the diversity budget of all liberal arts programs, and God only knows what else these Marxist indoctrination centers spend our money on.
Quote from: Sick Of Silence on July 29, 2018, 10:15:51 PM
It has to be like truck driving school: We will train you but you will have to work for us.
The VA is already doing it. It's called Residency.
Quote from: Solar on July 30, 2018, 05:49:39 AM
Gee, I don't know, why don't you dig up your, "What Ifs" and post them as evidence that every medical school in the country is run by leftist Profs.
I discovered a medical student forum that addresses it. Since they are actually in medical school, I will take their word on it that it is a real thing. Plus, I read some other discussion postings addressing related issues.
QuoteSo you agree, with my theory, that disallowing the schools to set diversity standards, is a good idea?
Yanking money out of their hands over discrimination would kill the left, they can't exist without taxpayer money.
Diversity is a code word for anti-white. That is also why I mentioned somebody getting accepted because of the color of their skin (and possibly low grades) instead of the person with the grades for medical school (or law school for that matter).
Quote from: Sick Of Silence on July 30, 2018, 08:05:44 AM
I discovered a medical student forum that addresses it. Since they are actually in medical school, I will take their word on it that it is a real thing. Plus, I read some other discussion postings addressing related issues.
Diversity is a code word for anti-white. That is also why I mentioned somebody getting accepted because of the color of their skin (and possibly low grades) instead of the person with the grades for medical school (or law school for that matter).
I see, you're in favor of the status quo, where colleges suck taxpayer dollars to support their liberal indoctrination scam in lieu of dictating just how they use our money? Got it.
We'll just keep on funding the SWJ movement. What is that they say about repeating the same mistake over and over again?
Yes or no, are you in favor of dictating how colleges use our tax dollars or not?
Quote from: The Boo Man... on July 29, 2018, 07:19:22 PM
This is why the government is in the student loan business. A bank is not going to give a student loan to someone who wants a degree in gender studies or lesbian basket weaving because they know the kid will never get a job and pay back the loan.
lol, that's funny. Loan officers should be able to say "Nope, not lending a penny for a piece of crap degree like that. That would be just as stupid as giving you a home loan for a house full of mold, snakes, and water".
Quote from: Solar on July 30, 2018, 08:14:00 AM
I see, you're in favor of the status quo, where colleges suck taxpayer dollars to support their liberal indoctrination scam in lieu of dictating just how they use our money? Got it.
We'll just keep on funding the SWJ movement. What is that they say about repeating the same mistake over and over again?
Yes or no, are you in favor of dictating how colleges use our tax dollars or not?
How in the fuck are you getting that I support Liberal college indoctrination when I am pointing out Liberal college indoctrination?
I don't want to give them free college in the first place. Only people that deserve that is military. You are the one that sounds like a Liberal.
If my money pays for a college, you damn right I want oversight.
what we have heeyah iss a failyuh to comyooicate .........
name the movie
Quote from: AndyJackson on July 30, 2018, 09:40:22 AM
what we have heeyah iss a failyuh to comyooicate .........
name the movie
From the 1967 film Cool Hand Luke.
Quote from: AndyJackson on July 30, 2018, 09:40:22 AM
what we have heeyah iss a failyuh to comyooicate .........
name the movie
Name the song that sampled it.
Quote from: Sick Of Silence on July 30, 2018, 10:29:53 AM
Name the song that sampled it.
I think it was Guns N' Roses in the song, Failure to communicate.
Quote from: walkstall on July 30, 2018, 10:52:30 AM
I think it was Guns N' Roses in the song, Failure to communicate.
Song was "Civil Wars".
Quote from: Sick Of Silence on July 30, 2018, 08:59:09 AM
How in the fuck are you getting that I support Liberal college indoctrination when I am pointing out Liberal college indoctrination?
Because you're arguing for the stasquo.
QuoteI don't want to give them free college in the first place. Only people that deserve that is military. You are the one that sounds like a Liberal.
If my money pays for a college, you damn right I want oversight.
Me, a Liberal? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
You're the one that doesn't want change.
That's my entire point, we are already paying for college, I'm saying we take that money and redirect it to the hard sciences.
My plan would kill the Marxist indoctrination system immediately.
Quote from: Solar on July 29, 2018, 04:13:26 PM
Just for shits and grins, II though I'd toss out some red meat for the left.
Bare with me, I'm just kidding, but I have a solution for the left's cry for free college.
Let us offer them free college, but there's a hitch, it has to be in the hard sciences, not freakin anthropology or anything like that, but actual science like math based degrees. :biggrin: (SJW run for safe spaces)
Give subsidies for trade schools in manufacturing as in engine repair, actual working trades.
How fast do you think liberal degrees would disappear?
OK, just a conversation starter, but using history as a guide, the left always gets its way, eventually, so let's kneecap them before they can institute free college for all.
Just half serious...
Your idea to require publicly funded colleges to offer actual job training, or likewise to only offer public school loans to students getting worthwhile degrees sounds like a good plan...in the short term. However, i would be worried about it in the long term. It seems that when the left is in power next time that they would just use this law for their own ends. They would twist it to basically say that only worthless leftist degrees and colleges wld be funded. A better long term plan seems to be removing the gvt from higher education completely (or from all education for that matter)
On a side note: I cant seem to tell what Solar and SoS are even arguing about... :confused: :confused: :confused:
Cant we all just get along? :thumbsup:
Quote from: Solar on July 30, 2018, 11:29:46 AM
Because you're arguing for the stasquo.
How do you figure that?
Quote from: T Hunt on July 30, 2018, 11:31:43 AM
Your idea to require publicly funded colleges to offer actual job training, or likewise to only offer public school loans to students getting worthwhile degrees sounds like a good plan...in the short term. However, i would be worried about it in the long term. It seems that when the left is in power next time that they would just use this law for their own ends. They would twist it to basically say that only worthless leftist degrees and colleges wld be funded. A better long term plan seems to be removing the gvt from higher education completely (or from all education for that matter)
That's why I say let's beat them to the punch, we all know eventually the left will get their free college Bill passed, Hell, had Hillary won, they'd be in the process as we speak, and the RINO would be there to help them.
I hate the entire idea of govt being involved on any level, but unless we get a solid Conservative Congress, nothing will change, so I'm trying to be pragmatic. GGod I hate this. :biggrin:
QuoteOn a side note: I cant seem to tell what Solar and SoS are even arguing about... :confused: :confused: :confused:
Cant we all just get along? :thumbsup:
He's just pissed because, twice now, I've thrown cold water on his claim that free speech is dead.
He'll get over it. :biggrin:
Quote from: Solar on July 30, 2018, 11:42:45 AM
He's just pissed because, twice now, I've thrown cold water on his claim that free speech is dead.
He'll get over it. :biggrin:
What does you accusing me of supporting Liberal status quo have to do me claiming Free Speech is dying?
Those are two separate issues.
Quote from: Sick Of Silence on July 30, 2018, 11:48:21 AM
What does you accusing me of supporting Liberal status quo have to do me claiming Free Speech is dying?
Those are two separate issues.
Oh cut the bullshit, you and I both know you're pissed because I told you to pick your battles. You start threads on free speech being attacked, problem is, you pick stupid issues to get excited over, and the latest was Alex Jones and the claim that Conservatives were under attack.
Jones is an idiot and not a Conservative.
If you want to use an example, there are thousands of examples, but Jones?
So, back to the subject a hand. Do you not agree it would be a good start to repurpose the money given to colleges or not?
Quote from: Solar on July 30, 2018, 11:59:16 AM
Oh cut the bullshit, you and I both know you're pissed because I told you to pick your battles. You start threads on free speech being attacked, problem is, you pick stupid issues to get excited over, and the latest was Alex Jones and the claim that Conservatives were under attack.
Jones is an idiot and not a Conservative.
If you want to use an example, there are thousands of examples, but Jones?
Obviously, you can't comprehend me saying I don't watch him but recognize the bigger picture. I do put other examples. He is just the current one. We will not have to wait long for another example. But, I can recognize the difference between a radio show host who is an ass and Liberal ran social media who are assholes.
I post examples. You say there is no problem. People disagree with that. Life goes on. I don't know why you are being pompous about it. I will still post those types of threads because it is a very important topic for me. You will always disagree. No need to make a big deal over it.
QuoteSo, back to the subject a hand. Do you not agree it would be a good start to repurpose the money given to colleges or not?
I agree with T Hunt so let's get government out of the education system. I said that college money should be for military only. I said that if you get money for college, there should be strings attached (because what's the use in becoming an American doctor if you are not doctoring in America - the truck driving analogy was a kind of a catch-all). Do you not understand that? How do you get that I support status quo from that?
Quote from: Sick Of Silence on July 30, 2018, 12:33:57 PM
Obviously, you can't comprehend me saying I don't watch him but recognize the bigger picture. I do put other examples. He is just the current one. We will not have to wait long for another example. But, I can recognize the difference between a radio show host who is an ass and Liberal ran social media who are assholes.
I post examples. You say there is no problem. People disagree with that. Life goes on. I don't know why you are being pompous about it. I will still post those types of threads because it is a very important topic for me. You will always disagree. No need to make a big deal over it.
I agree with T Hunt so let's get government out of the education system. I said that college money should be for military only. I said that if you get money for college, there should be strings attached (because what's the use in becoming an American doctor if you are not doctoring in America - the truck driving analogy was a kind of a catch-all). Do you not understand that? How do you get that I support status quo from that?
I have stayed out of this conversation, but have been keeping up with it. Let's be real, we will never get the government out of the education system. It is too ingrained in our culture and history. It had served us pretty well for almost 200 years. Now it has become a disaster. I do not have a solution because I do not know how we can purge the system from leftists now in charge. It begins with parents becoming more invovled with their students and schools far earlier than college.
Quote from: supsalemgr on July 30, 2018, 12:56:20 PM
I have stayed out of this conversation, but have been keeping up with it. Let's be real, we will never get the government out of the education system. It is too ingrained in our culture and history. It had served us pretty well for almost 200 years. Now it has become a disaster. I do not have a solution because I do not know how we can purge the system from leftists now in charge. It begins with parents becoming more invovled with their students and schools far earlier than college.
That's true for everything. They need to raise their children.
Quote from: supsalemgr on July 30, 2018, 12:56:20 PM
I have stayed out of this conversation, but have been keeping up with it. Let's be real, we will never get the government out of the education system. It is too ingrained in our culture and history. It had served us pretty well for almost 200 years. Now it has become a disaster. I do not have a solution because I do not know how we can purge the system from leftists now in charge. It begins with parents becoming more invovled with their students and schools far earlier than college.
A lot of parents us school as Babysitters, they do not get involved unless the school calls them with a problem. They don't go to PTA meeting. Parents freak out if schools closes down for two weeks as now they have to get a Babysitters and pay for it.
Quote from: supsalemgr on July 30, 2018, 12:56:20 PM
I have stayed out of this conversation, but have been keeping up with it. Let's be real, we will never get the government out of the education system. It is too ingrained in our culture and history. It had served us pretty well for almost 200 years. Now it has become a disaster. I do not have a solution because I do not know how we can purge the system from leftists now in charge. It begins with parents becoming more invovled with their students and schools far earlier than college.
I think it's the federal govt in education that most of us dislike. That's only about 45 years old, in its current bastardization.
Most of us constitutionalists are just fine with your town or county being invoved.
If we got the government out of the college loan business tuition would drop dramatically over night.
I don't know what the answer is short of a complete overhaul of all our education system. In my opinion, it is at the heart of the problem in our country. You can't continually send year after year of young impressionable minds into these liberal brain washing shitholes under the guise of "education" and expect a different outcome than what we are currently getting. Unless something is done we are going to lose control of this country...if we haven't already.
I think students should be learning while working on real-world projects. A kid shouldn't have to wait until he's out of school to do something real-world for a company. Companies have infinite tasks that are menial, but part of a larger project, that would get the kids in the game and provide some relief for the companies on the labor side.
Quote from: taxed on July 30, 2018, 10:13:22 PM
I think students should be learning while working on real-world projects. A kid shouldn't have to wait until he's out of school to do something real-world for a company. Companies have infinite tasks that are menial, but part of a larger project, that would get the kids in the game and provide some relief for the companies on the labor side.
I agree. They should at least have a job while going to school. That in itself is a learning experience.
Quote from: taxed on July 30, 2018, 10:13:22 PM
I think students should be learning while working on real-world projects. A kid shouldn't have to wait until he's out of school to do something real-world for a company. Companies have infinite tasks that are menial, but part of a larger project, that would get the kids in the game and provide some relief for the companies on the labor side.
Not that ive ever done it before, but isnt that what unpaid internships are for?
Quote from: T Hunt on July 31, 2018, 12:32:50 AM
Not that ive ever done it before, but isnt that what unpaid internships are for?
Yes, but something more integrated with school curriculum.
Quote from: taxed on July 31, 2018, 01:08:49 AM
Yes, but something more integrated with school curriculum.
Do you mean just college, or high school as well? Because high school vocational apprenticships sound like a great idea.
Quote from: T Hunt on July 31, 2018, 02:07:15 AM
Do you mean just college, or high school as well? Because high school vocational apprenticships sound like a great idea.
I would say yes if your not going into college you need all the vocational apprenticeship you can get.
You need all the high schooling you can get if your going into college. Some kids are taking in college what they should have had in high school.
https://www.myajc.com/blog/get-schooled/opinion-rethinking-fed-education-role-makes-sense-trump-plan-does-not/T19cWlKAznnDpcoxmvr1nJ/
I just saw this article this morning and gives a liberal view of how to fix our education system. Trump wants to combine the Education Department with the Department of Labor. This writer suggests we create a department of Children, Families and Communities. Oh boy, a department that not only screws up public education, but also "helps" us with families and communities. Liberals are truly dangerous.
Quote from: Sick Of Silence on July 30, 2018, 12:33:57 PM
Obviously, you can't comprehend me saying I don't watch him but recognize the bigger picture. I do put other examples. He is just the current one. We will not have to wait long for another example. But, I can recognize the difference between a radio show host who is an ass and Liberal ran social media who are assholes.
I post examples. You say there is no problem. People disagree with that. Life goes on. I don't know why you are being pompous about it. I will still post those types of threads because it is a very important topic for me. You will always disagree. No need to make a big deal over it.
I agree with T Hunt so let's get government out of the education system. I said that college money should be for military only. I said that if you get money for college, there should be strings attached (because what's the use in becoming an American doctor if you are not doctoring in America - the truck driving analogy was a kind of a catch-all). Do you not understand that? How do you get that I support status quo from that?
That was the entire point of this thread. Govt will never be out of education, so let's simply reevaluate the way our taxes are spent.
We are the bosses, the colleges are thieves, and our Reps are lying scum, and none of that is going to change, Govt seldom shrinks, even remotely, so to think this will change anytime soon is silly.
But I believe we are in a pretty good position to reassess how and where the money goes. I do believe this is achievable in our time.
Quote from: AndyJackson on July 30, 2018, 06:25:14 PM
I think it's the federal govt in education that most of us dislike. That's only about 45 years old, in its current bastardization.
Most of us constitutionalists are just fine with your town or county being invoved.
Yep, that's how it used to be. All about education, but those days are over, the left figured out a way to get rich off the taxpayer as well as corrupt our kids.
Quote from: The Boo Man... on July 30, 2018, 06:29:23 PM
If we got the government out of the college loan business tuition would drop dramatically over night.
Excellent first step!
Quote from: Fishman on July 30, 2018, 08:53:50 PM
I don't know what the answer is short of a complete overhaul of all our education system. In my opinion, it is at the heart of the problem in our country. You can't continually send year after year of young impressionable minds into these liberal brain washing shitholes under the guise of "education" and expect a different outcome than what we are currently getting. Unless something is done we are going to lose control of this country...if we haven't already.
Exactly! If nothing changes, we'll lose the next generation as well. This we can not afford, we damn near lost the country due to the latest one.
Quote from: taxed on July 30, 2018, 10:13:22 PM
I think students should be learning while working on real-world projects. A kid shouldn't have to wait until he's out of school to do something real-world for a company. Companies have infinite tasks that are menial, but part of a larger project, that would get the kids in the game and provide some relief for the companies on the labor side.
Excellent idea, give tax breaks to business that teaches a kid and gives them working skills. Interning should be half the prerequisite to graduation.
Quote from: T Hunt on July 31, 2018, 02:07:15 AM
Do you mean just college, or high school as well? Because high school vocational apprenticships sound like a great idea.
I agree, the earlier the better. Teaching responsibility early on is something most kids aren't getting today.
Can you imagine some kid taking pride in working an actual job, rather than 'hangin out n da hood'?
Quote from: supsalemgr on July 31, 2018, 05:05:35 AM
https://www.myajc.com/blog/get-schooled/opinion-rethinking-fed-education-role-makes-sense-trump-plan-does-not/T19cWlKAznnDpcoxmvr1nJ/
I just saw this article this morning and gives a liberal view of how to fix our education system. Trump wants to combine the Education Department with the Department of Labor. This writer suggests we create a department of Children, Families and Communities. Oh boy, a department that not only screws up public education, but also "helps" us with families and communities. Liberals are truly dangerous.
Oh God, how I despised Bush for all of this when he turned the schools over to Teddy.
And people wonder why others are homeschooling.
Quote from: Solar on July 31, 2018, 06:16:43 AM
Oh God, how I despised Bush for all of this when he turned the schools over to Teddy.
And people wonder why others are homeschooling.
one of the first things he did. I 'm still kicking the stump over that one. Did more damage to this country than libs on the supreme court.
Quote from: s3779m on July 31, 2018, 09:34:04 AM
one of the first things he did. I 'm still kicking the stump over that one. Did more damage to this country than libs on the supreme court.
Yep, killed an entire generation, Hell, they were indoctrinated to believe man made global warming thanks to his BS.
Quote from: Solar on July 31, 2018, 05:49:52 AM
That was the entire point of this thread. Govt will never be out of education, so let's simply reevaluate the way our taxes are spent.
We are the bosses, the colleges are thieves, and our Reps are lying scum, and none of that is going to change, Govt seldom shrinks, even remotely, so to think this will change anytime soon is silly.
But I believe we are in a pretty good position to reassess how and where the money goes. I do believe this is achievable in our time.
Thats defeatist talk soldier, snap out of it! *slap*
But seriously, trump has gained conservative victories that I never thought i wld see in my life. Miracles do happen.
But if gvt must be involved then I follow the founders plan, keep it as local as possible. When gvt is local it can spur a sense of pride similar to private ownership. Besides, there never used to be a dept of education and our parents are smarter than we are. So at least get the Federal gvt out, as many here have already said.
But moreso even then that, get the market place involved. That invisible hand is a miricle worker. Takeing away the advatages public school enjoys and throwing them into competition would solve many problems. I think we need to push homeschooling, vouchers, and private schools as much as possible, and certainly get the gvt out of those.
Quote from: T Hunt on July 31, 2018, 10:49:13 AM
Thats defeatist talk soldier, snap out of it! *slap*
But seriously, trump has gained conservative victories that I never thought i wld see in my life. Miracles do happen.
But if gvt must be involved then I follow the founders plan, keep it as local as possible. When gvt is local it can spur a sense of pride similar to private ownership. Besides, there never used to be a dept of education and our parents are smarter than we are. So at least get the Federal gvt out, as many here have already said.
But moreso even then that, get the market place involved. That invisible hand is a miricle worker. Takeing away the advatages public school enjoys and throwing them into competition would solve many problems. I think we need to push homeschooling, vouchers, and private schools as much as possible, and certainly get the gvt out of those.
That's how it was when we grew up, teachers actually answered to the parents, Parents Teachers Association, a group of parents banded together to actually guide the curriculum in their schools and hold the teacher's responsible.
Dims killed that off when they Unionized teachers against their will.
Quote from: Solar link=topic=31382.msg363117#msg363117 date=15330607Th26
Parents Teachers Association, a group of parents banded together to actually guide the curriculum in their schools and hold the teacher's responsible.
That's pure crazy talk! Let's make it happen again... :thumbup:
Quote from: Fishman on July 31, 2018, 08:00:34 PM
That's pure crazy talk! Let's make it happen again... :thumbup:
As a kid, I hated having my parents in the class. As an adult, I miss it, wish all parents would get involved today.