Quote from: dmf777 on May 25, 2015, 11:41:25 PM
Big government can provide necessary things like ...education for all.....

This is one idea, the notion that the state has an obligation to provide education for all, that many Americans, Democrats and Republicans alike, are really starting to come together in opposition to,  ideologically and practically. The pendulum is not swinging towards, and the verdict is not pointing towards, big government taking over the reins of education. To the contrary, we are hearing more and more of the failure of big government schools.

Yes, in many ways it is coming down to the line that separates people whose beliefs are in  in freedom, independence, and personal responsibility from people who, in Ronald Reagan's immortal words, "..never met a government program they didn't like."

What the late President was getting at is that there will always be people whose interest and politics includes the will, even in some cases the desire,  to ride on the backs of others, to set their tables with food purchased for them, to be taken care of, cradle to grave, not by their owns efforts and labors, but from the fruits of labor and production  of their neighbors.

In education, the principles are illustrated with such glaring clarity as to be nearly laughable, although it is no laughing matter. The absolute worst schools are to be found in neighborhoods where funding and rules are not in the hands of private citizens, but in the hand of government. These are the neighborhoods with very high public paid housing, where education is "provided by the government and free."  As we move further from that extreme, more in the direction of schools funded by property tax and controlled by voter elected school boards, the schools show a gradual and direct relationship to quality. Conservatives believe that observation reflects not so much  matters of geography or economics as it does matters of character and personal responsibility. Liberals, on the other hand, believe it is all about geography and economics, class, because that is what they have been told.

So many leftists accuse conservatives of seeing Reds under every rock. That's a lie. In fact, that's The Big Lie.

"Education? America is a joke. Falling behind in the world education standards because of low funding and poorly produced watered down curriculum. If the government funded more schools and (not controlled) but placed more high and advanced standards on the Public School systems, we would not be so low on the education chart."

Once again dmf777 is believing what the liberals are feeding him. Our education system is failing not because the government is not doing enough, but because the federal government is too involved with education. Funding is not the issue. The funding per student in failing systems are way above what some good systems are spending. The key is to let local governments have total control of their own systems.

Quote from: taxed on May 26, 2015, 01:09:39 AM
Explain.

Yes, it is tyrannical to steal our money to fund the assault on our freedoms, under the guise of the scams you named.

Wrong.  The problem with government is its size.
Hence why it needs to shrink.
No it can't.  That's what a communist would say.
That remains to be seen.
Nobody gives a shit, and doesn't give you any special pass to preach communism.
Wrong.  Conservatives are not hypocritical.  That would be liberals/Marxists.

Boy, did this kid check in at a bad time, or what?
He should have looked to see who was lurking before he jumped in the water.
Good job Taxed...

Quote from: dmf777 on May 25, 2015, 11:41:25 PM
Ralliers against big government seem to have no problem with the enormous war machine that is half the world's military and the biggest prison system on the planet. The "tyranny" label pops up only about public funds for education, healthcare, the environment, or unemployment insurance.

The Federal Government was designed to have limited powers and the rest belonged to the states.  The only reason we have a federal gov't is because of the permission of the states.  The best government is at the local level to see to the needs of their people. 

As far as a big military, it is the responsibility of the Federal gov't to protect the country.  When you have countries like China with over a billion people, who are building up their military to surpass ours, don't you think having a strong military is a deterrent to aggressive nations? 

As far as having the Federal government in control of health and education tells me how little you understand of our founding.  Education is the responsibility of the state, not the federal government.  In fact, the Federal Gov't is restricted from control of education.  The federal government should only be involved with healthcare to the extent of it's commerce responsibilities.  Do you really want the federal government in control of your medical decisions and access to care?  Do you really want to see doctors and hospitals dictated to by a giant bureaucracy?

Quote from: dmf777 on May 25, 2015, 11:41:25 PM
Ralliers against big government seem to have no problem with the enormous war machine that is half the world's military and the biggest prison system on the planet. The "tyranny" label pops up only about public funds for education, healthcare, the environment, or unemployment insurance. The problem with a government is not its size, but whose interests it serves. Big government can provide necessary things like healthcare, employment and education for all, and protect the earth. Or it can wage grisly wars in three countries at the same time!
Now don't misunderstand, I love America, I am a Christian Republican. But hypocrisy, especially when it has become so apparent, so outright such as being displayed by many Conservatives today, is disgraceful, and the government is necessary for any free and secure society to exist in unity.

Obamacare and our public education system prove the government is too big and is not capable.

Quote from: dmf777 on May 25, 2015, 11:41:25 PM
Ralliers against big government seem to have no problem with the enormous war machine that is half the world's military and the biggest prison system on the planet. The "tyranny" label pops up only about public funds for education, healthcare, the environment, or unemployment insurance. The problem with a government is not its size, but whose interests it serves. Big government can provide necessary things like healthcare, employment and education for all, and protect the earth. Or it can wage grisly wars in three countries at the same time!
Now don't misunderstand, I love America, I am a Christian Republican. But hypocrisy, especially when it has become so apparent, so outright such as being displayed by many Conservatives today, is disgraceful, and the government is necessary for any free and secure society to exist in unity.

The American Military is specifically authorized by the U.S. Constitution.

So-called public education is not!

The fact that the U.S. Military is the strongest in the world is a good thing. Keep in mind that during the Cold War, the U.S. Military protected, not only our own borders, but those of our allies - which included nearly all of Western  Europe! The reason the Europeans have had the liberty to experiment with socialism is because the lions share of the defense against the Soviets was bought and paid for by the American Taxpayer and enforced by U.S. Military personnel and equipment!

Quote from: supsalemgr on May 26, 2015, 06:06:06 AM
Our education system is failing not because the government is not doing enough, but because the federal government is too involved with education. Funding is not the issue. The funding per student in failing systems are way above what some good systems are spending. The key is to let local governments have total control of their own systems.

So much for throwing money at the problem.  In fact, after turning school jobs into highly paid political patronage positions,  those non-performing large districts add to the problems of the legitimate, locally controlled, locally funded, if there may be said to be such a thing, anymore.
How so? By artificially inflating salaries and benefits, the large districts have set the bar well above what the market would normally bear. One survey we will never see is the one that would reveal how many public school positions are occupied by wives and/or daughters of politically connected families, state or local.  The schools now resemble old fashioned Democratic patronage machines. The parents tend to be dis-satisfied.  So do the kids. The home owners pay their property taxes and keep their mouths shut.  All the symptoms of government tyranny.

In the meanwhile, the schools have become skilled at protecting the system and its jobs. This comes as no news. All this about the under preforming schools in Detroit and doing something about it is the joke, if we are looking for the joke. Holding the teachers and students to standards is like throwing the Christians to the lions, while the Romans look on. Democratic activists in Detroit claim, "It is the responsibility of the state to provide quality education to all the children in the state, so that they can go into the job market with the needed skills."  Sounds good, but the reality is something quite different. Less than 5% of 4th graders in Detroit are at level. Less than 1% are above.  94% would do just as well by guessing. How's morale?

Take the government out of the equation, and  run the school as a job scheme at your own peril.
The real teachers will gravitate towards the real schools, where they can do what attracted them to the field to begin with.

Quote from: dmf777 on May 25, 2015, 11:41:25 PM
Ralliers against big government seem to have no problem with the enormous war machine that is half the world's military and the biggest prison system on the planet. The "tyranny" label pops up only about public funds for education, healthcare, the environment, or unemployment insurance. The problem with a government is not its size, but whose interests it serves. Big government can provide necessary things like healthcare, employment and education for all, and protect the earth. Or it can wage grisly wars in three countries at the same time!
Now don't misunderstand, I love America, I am a Christian Republican. But hypocrisy, especially when it has become so apparent, so outright such as being displayed by many Conservatives today, is disgraceful, and the government is necessary for any free and secure society to exist in unity.

No your not. And if you say yes you are, then you're a liar. Christ himself said no man can serve two masters. Secondly, you might think your a republican, but what your espousing is RINO not true Republicanism.

Quote from: Solar on May 26, 2015, 06:29:18 AM

Boy, did this kid check in at a bad time, or what?
He should have looked to see who was lurking before he jumped in the water.
Good job Taxed...

Now we know what "dmf" stands for...

Quote from: taxed on May 26, 2015, 12:33:17 PM


Now we know what "dmf" stands for...

Quote from: taxed on May 26, 2015, 12:33:17 PM


Now we know what "dmf" stands for...

Quote from: taxed on May 26, 2015, 12:33:17 PM


Now we know what "dmf" stands for...

Doc and Sneezie were taken.

Quote from: taxed on May 26, 2015, 12:33:17 PM


Now we know what "dmf" stands for...

Quote from: walkstall on May 26, 2015, 04:27:32 PM

No what's scary? it is DMF777! That means there are at least 776 more just like him!!

Quote from: walkstall on May 26, 2015, 04:19:49 AM
I see taxed and quiller have a new chew toy.

Yeah, and ain't it fun to watch?   

Should I type in what dmf stands for or not?  ok here's part of it  "dumb mother ------.  Y'all can fill in the blanks.  Solar might kick me outta' here if I do it.