Author Topic: Problems with the so-called "watchmaker" argument  (Read 4373 times)

Offline kramarat

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Re: Problems with the so-called "watchmaker" argument
« Reply #30 on: November 11, 2012, 08:17:02 AM »
In other words, you don't even have the pretense of a logical argument, and ridicule the concept that someone would demand coherency in a debate.   :rolleyes:

You have difficulty with comprehension on the political forum..........even when facts are presented. If anyone could explain God in scientific terms, it would probably cause your brain to melt. We wouldn't want that.

Offline Sci Fi Fan

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Re: Problems with the so-called "watchmaker" argument
« Reply #31 on: November 11, 2012, 09:30:54 AM »
You have difficulty with comprehension on the political forum..........even when facts are presented.

Where did you present facts, other than a pseudoscientific extrapolation from general relativity you probably did not understand?

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If anyone could explain God in scientific terms, it would probably cause your brain to melt. We wouldn't want that.

That "anyone" clearly isn't you.  You're bluffing, and you know it.

Offline kramarat

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Re: Problems with the so-called "watchmaker" argument
« Reply #32 on: November 11, 2012, 09:34:54 AM »
Where did you present facts, other than a pseudoscientific extrapolation from general relativity you probably did not understand?

That "anyone" clearly isn't you.  You're bluffing, and you know it.

I'm not bluffing. God can't be explained in scientific terms.........not by me anyway.

This is another one of your threads that is a complete waste of time.

Offline Sci Fi Fan

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Re: Problems with the so-called "watchmaker" argument
« Reply #33 on: November 11, 2012, 10:04:08 AM »
I'm not bluffing. God can't be explained in scientific terms.........not by me anyway.

Not by anyone.  If something cannot be explained in scientific terms, it does not exist.

How about this:

Name me one thing other than God that cannot be explained scientifically even in theory, but still quite clearly exists.  And no, abstract ideals do not "exist".

Offline valjean

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Re: Problems with the so-called "watchmaker" argument
« Reply #34 on: November 11, 2012, 12:08:49 PM »
Not by anyone.  If something cannot be explained in scientific terms, it does not exist.


Would you say only things subject to perception by our particular five senses exist?

Offline Sci Fi Fan

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Re: Problems with the so-called "watchmaker" argument
« Reply #35 on: November 11, 2012, 12:37:57 PM »
Would you say only things subject to perception by our particular five senses exist?

OK, let me rephrase that:

Anything that cannot be objectively verified or supported through the scientific method has no reason for us to believe that it exists.

So technically, God could exist.  But the probability is pretty low, because the only way he could exist would be by coincidence.  Flying monkeys on Mars could exist, but for all intents of purposes we can conclusively say that they do not.

Offline kramarat

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Re: Problems with the so-called "watchmaker" argument
« Reply #36 on: November 11, 2012, 12:46:36 PM »
OK, let me rephrase that:

Anything that cannot be objectively verified or supported through the scientific method has no reason for us to believe that it exists.

So technically, God could exist.  But the probability is pretty low, because the only way he could exist would be by coincidence.  Flying monkeys on Mars could exist, but for all intents of purposes we can conclusively say that they do not.

Got it. So we can conclusively say that life does not exist anywhere but on planet earth. We cannot objectively verify or support it through scientific method, so there is no reason to believe that it exists.

You'd make a crappy scientist. :lol:

Offline Sci Fi Fan

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Re: Problems with the so-called "watchmaker" argument
« Reply #37 on: November 11, 2012, 02:11:28 PM »
Got it. So we can conclusively say that life does not exist anywhere but on planet earth. We cannot objectively verify or support it through scientific method, so there is no reason to believe that it exists.

No, we can use basic probability analysis (read: math) to suggest that life is very much likely to exist somewhere else in the universe (something that would turn Christian theology on its head).

Can you use similar arithmetic to establish that the probability of God existing is more than infinitesimal? 

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You see, your entire logic here is "you can't prove that X couldn't possibly exist, so it must exist."

I suppose we should start preparing for the invasion of the flying hippos from Jupiter sometime soon.   :smile:

Offline kramarat

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Re: Problems with the so-called "watchmaker" argument
« Reply #38 on: November 11, 2012, 03:19:47 PM »
No, we can use basic probability analysis (read: math) to suggest that life is very much likely to exist somewhere else in the universe (something that would turn Christian theology on its head).

Can you use similar arithmetic to establish that the probability of God existing is more than infinitesimal? 

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You see, your entire logic here is "you can't prove that X couldn't possibly exist, so it must exist."

I suppose we should start preparing for the invasion of the flying hippos from Jupiter sometime soon.   :smile:

God isn't something I argue about. You may have noticed that I haven't attempted to prove that God exists.

I know God exists. It must be lonely being you. It explains a lot of your behavior on here. I suspect that it ties in with much of the liberal anger that we see. Hatred is all you have. Pretty sad existence.

Offline Sci Fi Fan

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Re: Problems with the so-called "watchmaker" argument
« Reply #39 on: November 13, 2012, 01:18:54 PM »
God isn't something I argue about. You may have noticed that I haven't attempted to prove that God exists.

Then exactly what are you trying to prove?

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It must be lonely being you. It explains a lot of your behavior on here. I suspect that it ties in with much of the liberal anger that we see. Hatred is all you have. Pretty sad existence.

I'm actually quite happy without God in my life.  Maybe you don't understand this, but there comes a time when you can outgrow your imaginary friend and realize that you only have one life; here, on Earth.

Offline kramarat

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Re: Problems with the so-called "watchmaker" argument
« Reply #40 on: November 13, 2012, 02:35:29 PM »
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Then exactly what are you trying to prove?

 Nothing. You've done all the work for me. You're just an angry little a**hole.

According to your convoluted logic, anything that can't be mathematically or scientifically quantified can possibly exist, therefore.........

Love cannot possibly exist..............and neither can hate.

Infinity cannot be quantified, therefore the universe does not exist.

Pi cannot be quantified, therefore it cannot exist, and yet it is depended on daily...............just like God.

Like I said.......you'd make a crappy scientist. Scientists go out and do the work to either prove or disprove something. The very best you can ever come up with is a demand for someone else to to prove something. We have a word for those kind of people................LOSER.

Offline Sci Fi Fan

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Re: Problems with the so-called "watchmaker" argument
« Reply #41 on: November 13, 2012, 04:15:56 PM »

According to your convoluted logic, anything that can't be mathematically or scientifically quantified can possibly exist

I said exactly the opposite.  Please try again.

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Love cannot possibly exist..............and neither can hate.

Love and hate can both be scientifically verified.  You need to read up on this stuff.

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Infinity cannot be quantified, therefore the universe does not exist.

The universe is not infinite.  You need to read up on this stuff.

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Pi cannot be quantified, therefore it cannot exist, and yet it is depended on daily...............just like God.

Pi can be mathematically proven to exist.  And it can be quantified - just not in decimal or fraction form.  Try again.

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Like I said.......you'd make a crappy scientist. Scientists go out and do the work to either prove or disprove something. The very best you can ever come up with is a demand for someone else to to prove something. We have a word for those kind of people................LOSER.

You don't understand Burden of Proof or the Rule of Parsimony, and you think that the universe is infinite. 



You also came up with the "pi exists, therefore God exists!" argument, which just made my day.  That's the most convoluted piece of crap I've seen written all week.  Thanks!   :tounge:

Offline kramarat

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Re: Problems with the so-called "watchmaker" argument
« Reply #42 on: November 13, 2012, 04:27:57 PM »
I said exactly the opposite.  Please try again.

Love and hate can both be scientifically verified.  You need to read up on this stuff.

The universe is not infinite.  You need to read up on this stuff.

Pi can be mathematically proven to exist.  And it can be quantified - just not in decimal or fraction form.  Try again.

You don't understand Burden of Proof or the Rule of Parsimony, and you think that the universe is infinite. 



You also came up with the "pi exists, therefore God exists!" argument, which just made my day.  That's the most convoluted piece of crap I've seen written all week.  Thanks!   :tounge:

Ditto. Prove that the universe is finite. :thumbup:

Offline Sci Fi Fan

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Re: Problems with the so-called "watchmaker" argument
« Reply #43 on: November 13, 2012, 04:37:48 PM »
Ditto. Prove that the universe is finite. :thumbup:

You know as well as I that you have no idea what you're talking about.

Offline kramarat

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Re: Problems with the so-called "watchmaker" argument
« Reply #44 on: November 13, 2012, 05:46:36 PM »
You know as well as I that you have no idea what you're talking about.

You're pushing 720 posts, and haven't managed to make one valid point with any of them. :wink:

 

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