Atheism and Trans: a debate

[p1tchblack]

Figure it out for yourself, you just might have an epiphany.

I have figured it out for myself ,based on the scientific realities of brain functionality, and by taking a minute to make myself aware of the experience of thinking supports my belief.  So, if you believe in something different, - that we are somehow able to think independently of your thoughts/brain, then I'd like to know how you believe that would work.

[Solar]

I have figured it out for myself ,based on the scientific realities of brain functionality, and by taking a minute to make myself aware of the experience of thinking supports my belief.  So, if you believe in something different, - that we are somehow able to think independently of your thoughts/brain, then I'd like to know how you believe that would work.

So millennia of humanity has passed, and suddenly a group of nerds with a CT scan suddenly made this groundbreaking discovery, and you grabbed onto it and nothing is going to change your mind.....

Until the next great break through that expose just how simple minded these guys were.
When you live long enough, you learn not to take anything at face value.

I remember when the FDA pushed margarine over butter, corn oil over lard, saccharin over sugar. Get where I'm going? In other words, follow the money.
If you really want to understand this so called "Discovery", look at the money that backed it, and then you'll have your answer.

[p1tchblack]

So millennia of humanity has passed, and suddenly a group of nerds with a CT scan suddenly made this groundbreaking discovery, and you grabbed onto it and nothing is going to change your mind.....

Until the next great break through that expose just how simple minded these guys were.
When you live long enough, you learn not to take anything at face value.

I remember when the FDA pushed margarine over butter, corn oil over lard, saccharin over sugar. Get where I'm going? In other words, follow the money.
If you really want to understand this so called "Discovery", look at the money that backed it, and then you'll have your answer.

The beauty of not having free will is that your mind can change.  Mine can change and so can yours.... but that's another topic.

Look, I was just like you and probably 99% of the world in believing that "I" had free will.  I believed that I made choices.  I believed that there was a "self" that existed outside of my stream of thoughts and could observe them as they happened.  That simply isn't the case, and once you know that, you can't unknow it.

I know I've mentioned this a couple times, but it really is the simplest, yet best, example.  If I ask you to think of a movie, there are almost no constraints on what you can pick, except for movies that you're never heard of.  Most every other decision you make is more limited than picking a movie - who to marry, whether to have kids, who to vote for, etc.  But if I ask you think pick a movie and you spend some amount of time "thinking" of movies before settling on one, do you control that fact that, for example, Miracle on 34th Street doesn't come to mind?  I assume you've heard of Miracle on 34th Street, right?  But at that moment, the Miracle on 34th Street neurons just weren't firing. So, we're you free to choose a movie that didn't occur to you to choose?

[Solar]

The beauty of not having free will is that your mind can change.  Mine can change and so can yours.... but that's another topic.

Do you not hear the idiocy in that statement?

[p1tchblack]

Do you not hear the idiocy in that statement?

Note that I didn't say "You can change your mind". 

It may appear to be idiocy until you look at it closely.  We don't control our thoughts. Our thoughts originate in our brain, at a level over which we have no control or visibility, and those thoughts are the result of prior causes/experiences.  So, we don't control how our past experiences impact us.  You have no control over how what I'm typing is going to impact you.  Have no control over how the next thing you read or experience is going to impact future thoughts.  Are you free to not know that 2 + 2 is 4 if you know that 2 + 2 is 4?

[Possum]

Do you not hear the idiocy in that statement?

Why just single out that one? We have had manure spreaders that could not do the job his posts do.  If this is what our schools are turning out it is time to shut them down.

[Solar]

Note that I didn't say "You can change your mind". 

It may appear to be idiocy until you look at it closely.  We don't control our thoughts. Our thoughts originate in our brain, at a level over which we have no control or visibility, and those thoughts are the result of prior causes/experiences.  So, we don't control how our past experiences impact us.  You have no control over how what I'm typing is going to impact you.  Have no control over how the next thing you read or experience is going to impact future thoughts.  Are you free to not know that 2 + 2 is 4 if you know that 2 + 2 is 4?

Dude, your meds need adjusting.

[Solar]

Why just single out that one? We have had manure spreaders that could not do the job his posts do.  If this is what our schools are turning out it is time to shut them down.

Absolutely! Critical thought no longer exists in the schools.

[p1tchblack]

Dude, your meds need adjusting.

A common reaction...one you can't control either.

[Solar]

A common reaction...one you can't control either.

Well based on your nonsense, something other than you is controlling your thoughts, that leaves meds.

[RV]

A common reaction...one you can't control either.

So using your "logic", why hold anyone accountable for rape, molestation, theft, home invasion, robbery, murder, etc. After all, the criminals cannot help themselves and they have no control over their actions... This could apply to any law, rule, etc. Why even the politicians can say anything, do anything, promise anything and no one should be held accountable because they could not help themselves...

[walkstall]

So using your "logic", why hold anyone accountable for rape, molestation, theft, home invasion, robbery, murder, etc. After all, the criminals cannot help themselves and they have no control over their actions... This could apply to any law, rule, etc. Why even the politicians can say anything, do anything, promise anything and no one should be held accountable because they could not help themselves...

This is in place now on both sides.

[p1tchblack]

So using your "logic", why hold anyone accountable for rape, molestation, theft, home invasion, robbery, murder, etc. After all, the criminals cannot help themselves and they have no control over their actions... This could apply to any law, rule, etc. Why even the politicians can say anything, do anything, promise anything and no one should be held accountable because they could not help themselves...

If you have the mind of a rapist, murderer, etc, whether or not it's out of your control, you're still a danger to society.

[Possum]

If you have the mind of a rapist, murderer, etc, whether or not it's out of your control, you're still a danger to society.

How can you commit murder if it was not your intent?

[p1tchblack]

How can you commit murder if it was not your intent?

The thoughts, intentions, etc are still yours even if they're out of your control.