An Apology to Any and All

[taxed]

I recognize that having read a few research articles in scientific journals and a couple of science books does not make me an expert on evolution, and there are far more qualified people than I on the subject, but I know enough to know that the only people who call it a "cosmic accident" are creationist preachers.

I'll leave it at that, as I have no wish to engage in a debate between faith and observable scientific reality, nor is this really the place for it.

It's not clear what subject you have competence in to debate.

[Solar]

I recognize that having read a few research articles in scientific journals and a couple of science books does not make me an expert on evolution, and there are far more qualified people than I on the subject, but I know enough to know that the only people who call it a "cosmic accident" are creationist preachers.

I'll leave it at that, as I have no wish to engage in a debate between faith and observable scientific reality, nor is this really the place for it.

Solar, I'm glad you made it through your near death experiences. Sad about the others though, but that's life....short and unpredictable. People should remember more to enjoy it every day, because unlike sports, when life is done we don't get replays and re-matches.

One thing I've learned through these events, is take absolutely nothing for granted. I was told in no uncertain terms I was being watched over and guided and to pay attention.
After one of my near misses, which is what I call a close call with death, was to listen to God, or others may refer to it as "gut instinct" or "may the force be with you", whatever, your pick.

What I would do is head for work, of course I hated the current job, menial at best, so I'd ask God, which way? He'd say hang a left, go in that building and befriend someone, anyone, and invariably, I not only met a new friend, I influenced their life in untold ways, but after a short conversation I would always get a tip on someone hiring, and a better paying job.
This works for anything, you just have to be willing to use your imagination and open your mind to possibilities beyond your control.

Like I said, I use the term God, but you can call it "asking the cosmos", whatever makes you comfortable.
Whatever it is, it's an untapped source of positive energy, the only requirement is faith, faith that there is something out there bigger than life and for those I've talked to on the subject, agree, it's a positive force.

This is nothing new, since the beginning of time, man has sought guidance from the heavens.
Religions call it Angels, or other deities, but in my opinion, it's the same force.
One not need be religious, or even believe in God, simply have faith that life has more to offer than the tangible.
Try it, tap into it, you'll be pleased as to the results.

This same energy made it possible for me to retire in my early 40s debt free.

[Mountainshield]

Unfortunately this doesn't work with everyone, because there are some religious people  who seem to get offended at the idea that you don't believe in something, and get all nasty about it, and I refuse to simply be quiet and let them impose their beliefs on me.

Sounds like many atheists I know but none of the Christians, I have lost most of my childhood friends because they refuse to accept that I'm christian, have even had some of them scream at me like a hysterical woman because I'm against abortion, when I explain Kalam Cosmological argument they refuse to acknowledge that it is a legitimate philosophical standpoint to take to a logical rationalization of the existence of God or beginning of the universe and instead shut down my interruptions with ridicule along the lines with "so you believe Jesus walked on water what a fool you are haha" etc.

Of course all my current friends are atheist as well, and we have a mutual respect as we price Liberty above all else, and liberty is also the freedom to disagree.

Maybe it's different in Norway Christians live under constant ridicule by the media and pop culture so most Christians never express faith publicly and doing so in public bureaucracy will get you fired from work, so it is also an leftist atheist persecution of Christians while at the same time the leftist atheist embrace Islam. Most non state churches in Norway are closed to new members because of the fear of persecution and the fear of bringing the same ridicule they endure every day in the work place or school into church as well.

You never see Christians making fun of Atheists, but many atheists do everything they can to make fun of Christianity, just watch any of the most popular comedy show. I don't care myself, being a christian means enduring persecution as well, and if ridicule is the only thing I have to endure then that's fine with me compared to the execution/torture of Christians in North Korea, China, South-East Asia and Africa I'm thankful that it is not worse in the west.

I know some Christians in USA act very unchristian, and I suspect they are really satanic or atheists pretending to be christian as nothing they do is in line with Christianity or the Bible as i.e Westboro baptist church etc.

[Mountainshield]

As an Atheist, I've had some spirited debates with members here about religion and faith. While I always tried to do so civilly, in the heat of the discussion, I may have said somethings that were unkind, and hurtful. If I did so, or anyone took my posts that way, I apologize.

Also...

I have cast aside my non-belief, and while I don't consider myself a traditional Christian, I do believe in a high power that is capable of interacting with us mere mortals. It's a new journey for me, and I'm not sure where I am being led, but, as in the past, I only seek the Truth.

Darth

I am the wisest man alive, for I know one thing, and that is that I know nothing. - Sokrates

[Mountainshield]

One thing I've learned through these events, is take absolutely nothing for granted. I was told in no uncertain terms I was being watched over and guided and to pay attention.
After one of my near misses, which is what I call a close call with death, was to listen to God, or others may refer to it as "gut instinct" or "may the force be with you", whatever, your pick.

What I would do is head for work, of course I hated the current job, menial at best, so I'd ask God, which way? He'd say hang a left, go in that building and befriend someone, anyone, and invariably, I not only met a new friend, I influenced their life in untold ways, but after a short conversation I would always get a tip on someone hiring, and a better paying job.
This works for anything, you just have to be willing to use your imagination and open your mind to possibilities beyond your control.

Like I said, I use the term God, but you can call it "asking the cosmos", whatever makes you comfortable.
Whatever it is, it's an untapped source of positive energy, the only requirement is faith, faith that there is something out there bigger than life and for those I've talked to on the subject, agree, it's a positive force.

This is nothing new, since the beginning of time, man has sought guidance from the heavens.
Religions call it Angels, or other deities, but in my opinion, it's the same force.
One not need be religious, or even believe in God, simply have faith that life has more to offer than the tangible.
Try it, tap into it, you'll be pleased as to the results.

This same energy made it possible for me to retire in my early 40s debt free.

Very nice story, I was lost until I turned to God, and my life has changed drastically for the better. Not only with finding a good job, but also a excellent wife I could never have hoped for before. Still working on the retire at 40 debt free though 

Have you ever considered Esotericism?

[Solar]

Very nice story, I was lost until I turned to God, and my life has changed drastically for the better. Not only with finding a good job, but also a excellent wife I could never have hoped for before. Still working on the retire at 40 debt free though 

Have you ever considered Esotericism?

I've tried, like millions before me all kinds of theologies, virtually everyone of them in seeking answers, including meditation, but what I kept being drawn back to was individualism and a direct connection with God.
Unlike many beliefs of an overseer, go between, conduit, intermediary as in Priest, what have you, or even mass worship as in a day of prayer, I found it all came back to the individual, only you can make a connection with God, to relinquish that to a group is to lose the one on one connection needed for guidance.

I judge no one and their relation with a higher power, at least they understand this life is nothing when compared.
I find it interesting how so many think fame will make them somehow immortal, that having their name carved out in cement on a Hollywood sidewalk is in someway permanent, or building a pyramid and being entombed is forever.
When in less than a blink of Gods eye in time, the earth will cease to exist, and no one will ever know a thing about us.

Yeah, the need for understanding of our place here and now is incumbent upon us as individuals, but if a group can get one the answer, then good on them.
Like you, once I gave up the idea that my life was in someway bigger than God, that I was an individual and nothing could influence me and realized that opinion was the ignorance of a child speaking, like that of a toddler thinking they were big enough to go it alone through life.

It's why I am always so puzzled by atheists and their need to think they are somehow better and can go through life without never making the connection, whether it's arrogance or fear, by not making the connection, they are only hurting themselves.
Like having an opinion on the flavor of watermelon yet never having tried it, and still having an opinion nonetheless.
Yeah, I guess to them, their opinion is valid, but to those of us that have actually tried it, they look like spoiled children afraid of the unknown.

[Solar]

I recognize that having read a few research articles in scientific journals and a couple of science books does not make me an expert on evolution, and there are far more qualified people than I on the subject, but I know enough to know that the only people who call it a "cosmic accident" are creationist preachers.

I'll leave it at that, as I have no wish to engage in a debate between faith and observable scientific reality, nor is this really the place for it.

Solar, I'm glad you made it through your near death experiences. Sad about the others though, but that's life....short and unpredictable. People should remember more to enjoy it every day, because unlike sports, when life is done we don't get replays and re-matches.

I totally understand your apprehension to a higher power after reading this, and pretty much concur.

1) I wasn't talking to you. I was answering another poster who wanted to know my answer to those questions.

2) I think I have a pretty good idea about Christianity. I was raised in a Catholic family, was baptized, and went to Catholic church for the first 10 years of my life, then was exposed to non-denominational Christianity when my parents became protestants. Finally, by age 16 I started going on my own to a southern Baptist church, was baptized, and continued to go every weekend to Church until age 24 when I finally realized I could no longer believe the things I was taught and I left the church. After that I was an agnostic, and now I lean more towards agnostic atheist. To each his own, but that was the path my life took.

I too followed somewhat of a similar path, though nowhere near the exposure you had through family pressure.
My choices were my own to seek understanding. And like you, simply couldn't accept their answers.

But because of the failures of religion, is no reason to completely discount a higher power.
Your story is repeated millions of time around the globe, where religion actually drives people to the point of militancy towards organized religion and a rejection of spirituality.

But don't let that dissuade you from your own spiritual side and your connection to the here and now, because the two are inseparable, like an apple and it's core, the two cannot exist without one another.
In other words, don't lose contact with your center.

[TboneAgain]

I totally understand your apprehension to a higher power after reading this, and pretty much concur.

I too followed somewhat of a similar path, though nowhere near the exposure you had through family pressure.
My choices were my own to seek understanding. And like you, simply couldn't accept their answers.

But because of the failures of religion, is no reason to completely discount a higher power.
Your story is repeated millions of time around the globe, where religion actually drives people to the point of militancy towards organized religion and a rejection of spirituality.

But don't let that dissuade you from your own spiritual side and your connection to the here and now, because the two are inseparable, like an apple and it's core, the two cannot exist without one another.
In other words, don't lose contact with your center.

It's an easy and common mistake to equate religion and the concept of, and belief in, a higher power. The two are completely separate, except that religion usually tries to latch onto some higher power for the sake of legitimacy and primacy.

All religions, regardless of their aims, their structures, or their precepts, are constructs of mankind. That's why there are, for example, so many different flavors of Christianity. That's why there are Sunni Muslims, Shi'ite Muslims, and many other variations beyond those. According to Adherents.com, there are more than 4,200 religions in the world.

I've always said that the church I like best is the woods, where only a fool thinks it's quiet. It's where I've always felt closest to my own spirit. The magnificent integration of the forest world -- living things on so many levels in coexistence -- takes my breath. For me, it is clear and accessible evidence of the existence of what I call God.

[Solar]

It's an easy and common mistake to equate religion and the concept of, and belief in, a higher power. The two are completely separate, except that religion usually tries to latch onto some higher power for the sake of legitimacy and primacy.

All religions, regardless of their aims, their structures, or their precepts, are constructs of mankind. That's why there are, for example, so many different flavors of Christianity. That's why there are Sunni Muslims, Shi'ite Muslims, and many other variations beyond those. According to Adherents.com, there are more than 4,200 religions in the world.

I've always said that the church I like best is the woods, where only a fool thinks it's quiet. It's where I've always felt closest to my own spirit. The magnificent integration of the forest world -- living things on so many levels in coexistence -- takes my breath. For me, it is clear and accessible evidence of the existence of what I call God.

Well said, and I couldn't agree more. Pretty much the key reason I moved to the wilderness in the first place, to make a more spiritual connection to God.
And yes, I found it.

[TboneAgain]

Well said, and I couldn't agree more. Pretty much the key reason I moved to the wilderness in the first place, to make a more spiritual connection to God.
And yes, I found it.

I think you found Toy, and she put the fear of God in you! 

[walkstall]

I think you found Toy, and she put the fear of God in you! 

God does works in mysterious ways so they say.   

[Michelle]

As an Atheist, I've had some spirited debates with members here about religion and faith. While I always tried to do so civilly, in the heat of the discussion, I may have said somethings that were unkind, and hurtful. If I did so, or anyone took my posts that way, I apologize.

Also...

I have cast aside my non-belief, and while I don't consider myself a traditional Christian, I do believe in a high power that is capable of interacting with us mere mortals. It's a new journey for me, and I'm not sure where I am being led, but, as in the past, I only seek the Truth.

Darth

You know, I am new here and I keep reading this post and walking away from it.  I keep thinking to myself that I need to get a feel for the board before I start posting about religion.  I finally realized, if we can discuss politics then religion isn't going to be any different.

Let me see if I understand you.  You have had times where you slam dunked Christians (I'm not certain to what degree, I guess that is my hang up here) for merely being Christian but now you want to make nice because you have decided to "set aside" your lack of belief in trade for beliefs. 

Is that pretty much it?

Now, I have another question.  How does one "set aside" a lack of belief?  Believing or not believing in religion, higher power, God(s), it's not really like turning on and off a light switch.  I mean... either you do or you don't.  It's not like one day you just decide... I think I'll believe in a God.  I suppose it is true that many... MANY people are ignorant of atheism and I believe you are one of them.  Many theists believe atheists are "mad" at God thus, they become atheist.  Not so.  It's very difficult to be angry with something that does not exist for them.  At the same token many atheists believe faith is fully a choice.  It's not, when it is ingrained into your brain from birth it's not so easy to say you were wrong all those years.  All in all there is a ton of ignorance on both sides.

[Michelle]

I always ask them if they think we're the only beings in the universe to evolve from monkeys.

Actually...  those that really do understand evolution do not believe we evolved from monkeys.  A good book on the topic would go a long way when discussing this issue.   

[Michelle]

Good point.

It occurs to me to wonder who came up with monkeys in the first place.

???  Those that do not understand evolution?   

[Michelle]

Psssst...There's only one.
Did you have a father, did your father have a father, and his father and so on? Well, that's life, and everything had a beginning and a father, if you will.
Whether or not the father is present in our lives or not, is irrelevant, the fact that we're here, validates his existence.

FWIW, I'm not religious in any sense of the word.

Nahhh... there are a ton of Gods out there.  Matter of fact,there is a God for each theist looking in a mirror every morning.  Their God is the *only* God, there is only one God and it is their God.  Their God just happens to have a similar take on the bible as the person looking in the mirror.  Or, in the case of someone such as a Hindu - Gods.  But it all comes down to one simple fact.  There is no proof of any of these Gods.  Not one of them.  If there was, theists wouldn't need faith.  They'd have facts instead.  What one believes is not a fact, what one can prove is a fact.

There isn't a thing in the world wrong with faith in a God.  Nothing, nada, zilch.  It's mighty A-ok with me if someone wants to believe in a God.  Just don't call it fact because it "feels" so real or better yet, because one can't admit they just plain don't know the answer to a question.

People used to believe Ra the Sun God pulled the sun around the earth in his chariot each day.  Then science came along and explained how it works and suddenly, a God didn't do THAT but he does everything else.     And the list goes on what a God did until science explained how it really works.

There are some questions I just don't know the answer.  I have no problem saying.. I dunno.  But I can't create a God to answer everything I don't know.