Quote from: quiller on March 05, 2016, 02:48:54 AMWhy am I offensive? It's a calling. I blew off hobby a long time ago.

No.
WHY? is he apologizing on your behalf?

Quote from: ZQuickSilverZ on March 05, 2016, 05:28:52 AM
No.
WHY? is he apologizing on your behalf?

Well, I had wondered about that, but as you may have noted, I plead no contest to being "offensive" against the typical liberal. As to why he volunteered, who am I to argue here?   

Quote from: ZQuickSilverZ on March 05, 2016, 05:28:52 AM
No.
WHY? is he apologizing on your behalf?

-sniff-  Julie Andrews moment, "just a spoon full of sugar helps the medicine go down"... after being smacked across the back of the head with a 2x4. 

Quote from: Hoofer on March 05, 2016, 06:40:01 AM
-sniff-  Julie Andrews moment, "just a spoon full of sugar helps the medicine go down"... after being smacked across the back of the head with a 2x4.

That's my other approach. Among them, anyway.

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Tech schools have been very good for me!  If you're the kind of person who gets overloaded with classroom stuff, but really learns easily with hands-on, experimenting, or apprenticeship - take those opportunities, and run with them. 

An added bonus, the teachers are on the "lookout" for prime students, businesses are always looking for good people - tech schools are some of the places they go looking for them.  A great place to meet and forge "business alliances".

Quote from: Hoofer on March 18, 2016, 05:37:26 PM
Tech schools have been very good for me!  If you're the kind of person who gets overloaded with classroom stuff, but really learns easily with hands-on, experimenting, or apprenticeship - take those opportunities, and run with them. 

An added bonus, the teachers are on the "lookout" for prime students, businesses are always looking for good people - tech schools are some of the places they go looking for them.  A great place to meet and forge "business alliances".

Trust me that where I would look for good help, that and word of mouth is number one for me.

Quote from: walkstall on March 18, 2016, 05:41:40 PM
Trust me that where I would look for good help, that and word of mouth is number one for me.

One of my most successful businesses was started solely on a whim, after I bumped into a guy who needed some help running some phone cabling at a users group meeting.  Being the inexperienced newbe willing to take a whack at anything, the guy asked me if I could lend a hand on a weekend - I said "sure!".  For free, of course, because the experience in a different environment would be worth it.  The rest of the people in the users group... were basically afraid to touch anything, clean or dirty.  They probably wrote good reports, and said "yes Sir" with a particular enthusiasm.

After a few hours of sweat, dirt and testing, the guy mentioned, 'Ya know, there's a real business opportunity for someone with these other user's group members - they're always loaded with questions & looking for help with stuff.'  Word of mouth.  I was buying gear I never expected, tools and switch cards, to serve my rapidly growing customer base.  The really neat part about it, the same guy who got me started, became one of my biggest customers.  He practically launched a whole new career path for me, suggested specific schooling, introduced me to potential customers - were it not for that users group meeting, it's hard to imagine doing what I do today.

There was one strange experience in that business, it was with the majority of people already in the same line of work... never seemed to work out.  I'd offer more money for similar work, and get burned.  One big project, which required 2 two man teams of technicians and a 5th guy programming (and coordinating via hand held radio), we were short 1 person.  Where this one "new guy" came from, I'll never know, but he needed $, and one of my crew suggested we try him on this project... he was "thorough and fast".  The night of the big job, he was a no-show.  Didn't answer the phone, so I thought he wrecked his car or something.  His wife's cat had to go to the vet, and -he- had to take it.  Couldn't call me, knew we had this planned activity - I had brought him to the jobsite a week before and we walked through the whole thing.  He knew his part was crucial for the success of the project.  Now he was nowhere to be found & couldn't call.  What should have taken from 5pm till 10 or 11pm, took us well past 4am.  Very embarrassing for all of us.

Not the next day, but several days later, my phone rings, and this guy who has "a job in the industry",  left us hanging... is begging for CASH.  Not a job, but a CASH advance - and promising he would "do anything" to pay it off.  He'd never worked for me, not a minute.  I got the cat story excuse, why his wife couldn't drive the sick cat to the vet, etc., etc., BUT...  decided I'd try to help him out, even offering to come pick him up, buy him a sub-sandwich (dinner) & drop him off.  Nope, couldn't do it, couldn't work those kinds of evening hours.  It didn't matter that 99% of the work was after 5pm, the rest weekends and holidays - he kept asking for $ and that was it.  No sob story, he was sounding like a bill collector, except I owed him nothing.  I said, "come on over, I'll loan you $200 and you can work it off on some of the weekend work", (figuring I'd never see it again).  Nope, he wanted me to deliver it.  >click<  he hung up.

Months later, I got another call from this guy, begging for a job - he had been laid off or fired or quit, needed work, said he would do ANYTHING.  By circumstance alone, timing, whatever, there was nothing I could do, not even loan him $10, because I was waiting to get paid by my customers.  I had no money, no work - and that was the last time I ever heard from him or about him.  He was the LAST person I tried to hire from within the industry.  From there on, I looked for the "right attitude and willingness to work" as my only criteria, the "experienced professional" almost cost me a customer.

All that to say this:  Minimum wage was less than $4 per hour in the 80s & 90s.  We paid $20 per hour for the "right attitude & willingness to work".  I guaranteed each person, "You will make at least $100 each day working for me."   In a customer-facing business, the last thing I needed was losing customers because I hired the wrong guy.   Same standard applies today.